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NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
http://www.x404.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=21679		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  pcernie [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:05 pm ]
Post subject:  NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014 ... hip-charge

:roll:
Author:  cloaked_wolf [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 11:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
Load of bollocks. The entire point of NI contributions was essentially for the NHS. Raise the NHS contributions if you must. Or stop trying to make the £2bn savings which are then not ploughed back into the NHS. Or go after the £40bn owed in taxes (can't recall exact figure).

One of the NHS principles was free at the point of use. Now you want to charge? This IMO is setting a precedent towards privatisation in terms of client access. At the moment, a service in the NHS that was previously provided by a hospital or GP surgery can be "put out to tender" - in other words, cheapest bid gets it. This means that you have private companies who often take contracts. There are a lot of private companies, and people who are part of private companies, with their sticky hands in the NHS pie pot.

If you start setting up a system to charge patients, what you're doing is removing one of the largest obstacles to privatisation - the public. Once you can get them to accept it, they'll happily swallow anything else. The biggest problem is that the highest users of the NHS are the young and the elderly, both of whom will be exempt. What might be happening is that you get those who can pay will be offered a different service thereby creating a two-tier service - a nice "cushty" one that people can pay for, and the current one which is the default.
Author:  TheFrenchun [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 11:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
I can see contagious diseases such as TB come back in force if you charge for GP consultations :?
Author:  paulzolo [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 12:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
cloaked_wolf wrote:
Load of bollocks. The entire point of NI contributions was essentially for the NHS. Raise the NHS contributions if you must. Or stop trying to make the £2bn savings which are then not ploughed back into the NHS. Or go after the £40bn owed in taxes (can't recall exact figure).

One of the NHS principles was free at the point of use. Now you want to charge?


I pay a tax for my prescriptions (not enough to make a pre pay certificate worth while, though), and as I’m one of those who actually needs more than just the occasional box of antibiotics, I know that the NHS is not as free at the point of use as people like to think.

I’m biased, but I really think that people with chronic lung conditions should get free prescriptions in the same fashion that diabetics get free prescriptions. The only problem with this is lung problems are perceived as “bad” because the sufferer may have been a smoker. :(

cloaked_wolf wrote:
This IMO is setting a precedent towards privatisation in terms of client access. At the moment, a service in the NHS that was previously provided by a hospital or GP surgery can be "put out to tender" - in other words, cheapest bid gets it. This means that you have private companies who often take contracts. There are a lot of private companies, and people who are part of private companies, with their sticky hands in the NHS pie pot.

If you start setting up a system to charge patients, what you're doing is removing one of the largest obstacles to privatisation - the public.

In more ways than one, I expect.
Author:  cloaked_wolf [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 12:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
paulzolo wrote:
I pay a tax for my prescriptions (not enough to make a pre pay certificate worth while, though), and as I’m one of those who actually needs more than just the occasional box of antibiotics, I know that the NHS is not as free at the point of use as people like to think.

I’m biased, but I really think that people with chronic lung conditions should get free prescriptions in the same fashion that diabetics get free prescriptions. The only problem with this is lung problems are perceived as “bad” because the sufferer may have been a smoker. :(


I don't massively agree with prescription charges but I can see the point in some respects - patients will often come to get paracetamol from me rather than may 16p for the cheap stuff from asda. The prescription charge is similar to the above charges - those who aren't under 16, on benefits, or retired/elderly have to pay. Even then, the exemptions are a bit weird. You can be exempt from all meds if you're diabetic and on treatment, but not if you're asthmatic. Given that not using your inhalers can lead to hospitalisation means that it should also be exempt. Furthermore, if you were going to exempt people on the basis of a condition, the medications for that specific condition should be free. Otherwise IMO you should pay. Or just make it free for everyone.
Author:  TheFrenchun [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 2:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
paulzolo wrote:
cloaked_wolf wrote:
Load of bollocks. The entire point of NI contributions was essentially for the NHS. Raise the NHS contributions if you must. Or stop trying to make the £2bn savings which are then not ploughed back into the NHS. Or go after the £40bn owed in taxes (can't recall exact figure).

One of the NHS principles was free at the point of use. Now you want to charge?


I pay a tax for my prescriptions (not enough to make a pre pay certificate worth while, though), and as I’m one of those who actually needs more than just the occasional box of antibiotics, I know that the NHS is not as free at the point of use as people like to think.

I’m biased, but I really think that people with chronic lung conditions should get free prescriptions in the same fashion that diabetics get free prescriptions. The only problem with this is lung problems are perceived as “bad” because the sufferer may have been a smoker. :(

cloaked_wolf wrote:
This IMO is setting a precedent towards privatisation in terms of client access. At the moment, a service in the NHS that was previously provided by a hospital or GP surgery can be "put out to tender" - in other words, cheapest bid gets it. This means that you have private companies who often take contracts. There are a lot of private companies, and people who are part of private companies, with their sticky hands in the NHS pie pot.

If you start setting up a system to charge patients, what you're doing is removing one of the largest obstacles to privatisation - the public.

In more ways than one, I expect.


My brother has an similar condition in France. He has to pay upfront for lung xrays every month, gp appointments, intercostal injections. They get refunded to him in time, but he is typically €300+ out of pocket. On an apprentice wage, that's a lot of money. If my parents didn't bail him out, I think he'd just go without and end up clogging the ER every few weeks.
Author:  cloaked_wolf [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 2:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
I have been told the French system is better and that it's what we should aspire to. I've also been told that the French govt was looking at the NHS system as an alternative. How does it work over there?
Author:  TheFrenchun [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 7:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
In France you pay upfront, normally ~30e to see the GP and get refunded by your pct. there is an excess on a lot of procedures, so most people have health insurance to cover that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Author:  l3v1ck [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 7:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
If they want to kncok my NI contributions down to just £10 a month, that's fine by me. ;)

It's bad enough having to pay for dentist work (even on the NHS). Doctors too, that would be taking the piss and put poor older pensioners from going. And they're the people who need to go most.
Author:  cloaked_wolf [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 9:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014 ... vatisation
Author:  pcernie [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
My cynical brain says it's just more of the softening you up for what they're gonna attempt anyway.
Author:  pcernie [ Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NHS users should pay £10 a month, says ex-health minister
New NHS chief angers unions with praise for private sector innovation

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014 ... innovation

That was either deliberate or he's just thick. Either way, it hardly inspires confidence.
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