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Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
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Author:  Amnesia10 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 6:19 am ]
Post subject:  Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/8607014.stm

Quote:
MPs are suggesting adopting a system used in Holland to reduce the number of 16 to 25-year-olds not in education, employment or training - "Neets".
They said the Dutch equivalent of jobseeker's allowance was dependent on being in work, education or training.
At the end of 2009, nearly 15% of 16 to 24-year-olds were classed as Neets.

Yes but what would they say if we had the levels of youth unemployment in Spain, of nearly 40% youth unemployed?
Author:  dogbert10 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 7:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
Maybe it would encourage some of them to take the jobs that immigrants are filling. It seems at the moment that a lot of people leaving education expect to be given a job and handed everything on a plate. They seem to have forgotten that to get anywhere today takes hard work - you can't simply turn up and get paid. Workers from places like Poland understand this and are prepared to work for wages a lot of our "workers" won't.

Call it lazyness or whatever, but if someone doens't want to work, then why should they be paid to sit at home in front of their plasma TV in a council-provided house and do nothing except sponge? Bring back National Service.

See what I mean?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/electio ... rrer=yahoo
Author:  Amnesia10 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 12:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
dogbert10 wrote:
Call it lazyness or whatever, but if someone doens't want to work, then why should they be paid to sit at home in front of their plasma TV in a council-provided house and do nothing except sponge? Bring back National Service.

See what I mean?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/electio ... rrer=yahoo

There are not that many council homes left. Not after the Tories sold a lot of them off. I do agree about them getting a work ethic, but that is not helped when the minimum wage is barely above benefit levels. If the minimum wage was higher and there was clear blue water between the rates they could get I would expect they would get off their butts.
Author:  Linux_User [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
Lazy? British workers are some of the hardest working in Europe - we work ridiculously long hours and compared to people in the Netherlands are under-paid.

You can stuff your National Service, I'd rather go to prison than be forced into slavery.

As for not getting benefits? What? If you're not in employment, training or education then surely that's the very definition of someone who is in need? After I graduate there's no guarantee of a job, what am I supposed to live off exactly? People's good will?
Author:  jonlumb [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
Linux_User wrote:
Lazy? British workers are some of the hardest working in Europe - we work ridiculously long hours and compared to people in the Netherlands are under-paid.

You can stuff your National Service, I'd rather go to prison than be forced into slavery.

As for not getting benefits? What? If you're not in employment, training or education then surely that's the very definition of someone who is in need? After I graduate there's no guarantee of a job, what am I supposed to live off exactly? People's good will?


Then emigrate. Simples.

At the end of the day, I suspect there are far more people on benefit that are simply in need of a good kick up the arse than there are genuinely in need. Be grateful you don't live in the USA.
Author:  hifidelity2 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
Linux_User wrote:
As for not getting benefits? What? If you're not in employment, training or education then surely that's the very definition of someone who is in need? After I graduate there's no guarantee of a job, what am I supposed to live off exactly? People's good will?


If you are not in one of those then to get befits you need to enrole in one.
Personally I think if you get benifits then you sould work for them - some form of community service a couple of days a week
Author:  dogbert10 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
Amnesia10 wrote:
dogbert10 wrote:
Call it lazyness or whatever, but if someone doens't want to work, then why should they be paid to sit at home in front of their plasma TV in a council-provided house and do nothing except sponge? Bring back National Service.

See what I mean?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/electio ... rrer=yahoo

There are not that many council homes left. Not after the Tories sold a lot of them off. I do agree about them getting a work ethic, but that is not helped when the minimum wage is barely above benefit levels. If the minimum wage was higher and there was clear blue water between the rates they could get I would expect they would get off their butts.


That sums it up nicely - it's all about money. What about the experience gained from actually working, which demonstrates to prospective employers that you're prepared to make the effort to do something rather than collect the dole. If I was going to employ someone, then I'd go for someone who's actually done something rather than sit at home all day.

Housing is a tricky problem. Builders aren't going to build new "affordable" housing unless they're sure they'll sell it, the Government is broke so they can't build any, and given how high house prices are now, a lot of first time buyers can't afford it because of the large deposits required for mortgages. So unless house prices drop considerably, the situtaion isn't going to change. Catch 22.
Author:  Linux_User [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 3:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
jonlumb wrote:
Then emigrate. Simples.


Or not. This is my country too and I have just as much right to object to a [LIFTED] policy as anyone else.
Author:  belchingmatt [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
Linux_User wrote:
After I graduate there's no guarantee of a job, what am I supposed to live off exactly? People's good will?


There is no guarantee of any job, but if you only look for graduate jobs then you won't be doing yourself any favours.
Author:  Amnesia10 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 4:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
dogbert10 wrote:
That sums it up nicely - it's all about money. What about the experience gained from actually working, which demonstrates to prospective employers that you're prepared to make the effort to do something rather than collect the dole. If I was going to employ someone, then I'd go for someone who's actually done something rather than sit at home all day.

Yes but if you are in a low paid job with no training or prospects and would probably be better off on benefits why bother? The same applies to couples. The benefits system actually penalises couples where one works. If one is disabled they would probably be better off separating. When governments create perverse incentives then they will be abused. Australia has a similar problem with couples benefits. You get more as two singles than as a couple. So they set up fake second homes where one apparently lives. All because the combined benefit is lower than two single benefits. If the government actually woke up to reality and abolished couples benefits and then if in a couple one got work they would know exactly how much better off they would be. It would then slash the numbers of households where no one worked.

dogbert10 wrote:
Housing is a tricky problem. Builders aren't going to build new "affordable" housing unless they're sure they'll sell it, the Government is broke so they can't build any, and given how high house prices are now, a lot of first time buyers can't afford it because of the large deposits required for mortgages. So unless house prices drop considerably, the situtaion isn't going to change. Catch 22.

Even worse than that, housing associations relied on rising housing prices to fund their plans. So with a collapsing property market it will end many housing associations building programs.
Author:  dogbert10 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 5:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
So to sum up - we're screwed.
Author:  forquare1 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 5:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
belchingmatt wrote:
Linux_User wrote:
After I graduate there's no guarantee of a job, what am I supposed to live off exactly? People's good will?


There is no guarantee of any job, but if you only look for graduate jobs then you won't be doing yourself any favours.


Precisely, I'm graduating this year and my first job as a graduate will probably be in Morrisons or something.
If you are actively looking for a job and you have no source of income, then you should get benefits.

I'd like to see the phrase "you're over qualified" made illegal to use as an excuse for not employing someone. A mate of mine that graduated last year was applying for every job he could, from games development to web design to cleaning loos and working in McDonalds...A number super markets and a few job agencies wouldn't take him on because he had a degree and was "over qualified" to stack shelves or clean toilets, etc...Meaning he was pushed back down and was being supported by his parents (he refused to try for benefits, council housing etc.).
Author:  Amnesia10 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 5:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
dogbert10 wrote:
So to sum up - we're screwed.

Yep but you will not find a politician who will admit it.
Author:  ShockWaffle [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 8:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
dogbert10 wrote:
See what I mean?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/electio ... rrer=yahoo

The conclusion reached (that Labour has betrayed British born workers) not only doesn't follow from the facts recited, but is clearly disproved by them. It would only be a valid argument if they could show that the jobs taken by foreign workers are subsidised by UK taxes. All they have is that the UK economy grew a lot and created a lot of jobs, but UK born workers pursued public sector careers. Everything else they said is unsupported by any evidence they presented.

It's a very stupid article that requires a particular prejudice on the part of the reader (ie, that any job filled by foreign labour is stolen from a native) to have any force at all.
Author:  Amnesia10 [ Thu Apr 08, 2010 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neets 'should not get benefits', say MPs
It is totally untrue but that is the Daily Mail for you. If it were true then there would be no one under thirty with a job. Which is clearly not the case. The problem about jobs being filled by foreigners is that the government have basically tried to get most kids into university and then higher paid jobs. When in reality there are a huge range of jobs from menial low paid jobs which are not paid enough to be worth coming off benefits to heads of banks with telephone book salaries and where are the poles running the banks?

Labour have let the working class down buy not creating millions of homes so that they can either rent a home or buy one. They have also allowed rampant house price inflation which has priced many of them out of society. So they are in cramped accommodation and then see asylum seekers jump the housing queue because of the lack of housing.
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