also stopped us punishing innocent people, unlawful imprisonmnet, brutal policing, working excessive hours, being persectuted merely for our beliefs or race etc..

But hey I'd give all that up and more just so those prisoners don't get a PS3.

I've had enough of this.

You all seem to have misunderstood something rather vital.

Broadmoor is not, repeat NOT, a prison. It is a special hospital - specifically one of the three high-security psychiatric hospitals in England. It is designed as a hospital, run as a hospital and, as much as possible, staffed like a hospital. The residents are patients and are treated for severe mental illnesses, personality disorders and psychiatric injuries. Furthermore the vast majority are resident for much less than the average of 6 years - the average only being this high due to a small proportion of long-term patients.

These people aren't there because they made a rational choice to do something criminal. These are people whose minds are so bent, broken and shattered that they need 24 hour supervision, sequestration and treatment.

Should psychiatric patients be allowed games systems? Absolutely. It's no different to allowing them to watch TV or play board games. We should be trying to treat, help and heal the poor bastards and if buying a few Nintendos gets them nearer to sanity then I'm all for it.

I've had a psychiatric injury and I can tell you it's a hell far worse than physical pain. Try being an Electronics Engineer and ex-American Footballer at the age of 25 sitting on the corner of your bed crying, sucking your thumb, rocking backwards and forwards and having pissed yourself because the dreams won't go away and then tell me that a Nintendo is going too far.

I am not ashamed to have gone a little "loony" - I had a chemical imbalance caused by several traumatic experiences that eventually caused my mind to break. I am indescribably indebted to the people that took me by the hand and helped me gain back my mind, my dreams and my life. I am also proud of myself for the fight that I had to put up.

But if this is really the attitude we have towards the most vulnerable people in our society then the only thing I feel truly ashamed of is my nationality.

Unless you've been there you really should keep your mouth well and truly buttoned.

Oh and given roughly one third of you will develop a mental illness at some point in your life perhaps you shouldn't be quite so quick to judge.

[/soapbox]

Well said sir

+1

Well said Rusty.

And I don't mean that as a slight to anyone with a different opinion.

All of which is fair enough and completely true, along with everything else you said as far as I can see, but am I supposed to believe that all the people there are what the public would consider 'genuine patients'? I'm talking about once you get past the media hype I alluded to in the OP and so on and actually get down to the facts of cases and people like Ronnie Kray, for instance.

The public probably wouldn't believe he was insane, more somebody who knew what he wanted and how to get it, probably believing himself untouchable, which he effectively was for a long time. It's the grey areas of it all like him that bother me, especially when there's quite a few quotes knocking about of him and people like him telling others they had it 'comfy' compared to the cell they'd otherwise be in.

The definitions of 'sociopath' and 'psychopath' for instance still get debated today (actually my avatar character has often been used as a kick-off point for discussions like that amongst professionals ). I'm just saying that that's where the doubt comes in for me personally - I'll let others talk for themselves.

Also, I expect most of the sentiment here is actually about prisoners of whatever hue having quite a 'relaxed' time of it considering some of their crimes and a perception of what prison should be, karma-wise or however you wanna put it

Again, I'll let other people talk for themselves...

For our judiciary systems to work you need an innocent till proven guilty stance on everything therefore the decision that someone is innocent, mentally not responsible or guilty must be held firm.

These people are all under the law devoid of responsibility due to being not responsible for insanity purpose and remain that way until they would be proven otherwise so your argument here is out of the question since that would be a different matter. So as far as all us on this thread are concerned the people in broadmoor are mentally unstable regardless of what the public like to believe because the daily mail, express or sun said so.

The "public" as an entity are usually the worst judges of anything to do with medicine. And don't confuse rumour, gossip and popular myth with fact.

Ronnie and Reggie Kray were sentenced to life imprisonment with a non-parole period of 30 years. Reggie ended up in Maidstone Prison whilst Ronnie wound up in Broadmoor.

Now given that they were incarcerated at the same time and for the same crimes why were the two brothers given such different treatments? If Ronnie really was pretending and aiming for the high-life at Broadmoor then why didn't Reggie get the same? Moreover why would any Home Secretary ever let Ronnie's representatives successfully claim insanity if there were any doubt that he wasn't crazy and was actually just an evil bastard.

The fact is that Ronnie suffered from paranoid schizophrenia - where "the clinical picture is dominated by relatively stable, often paranoid, delusions, usually accompanied by hallucinations, particularly of the auditory variety, and perceptual disturbances." This is a condition that, in order to qualify for treatment at Broadmoor, has to be pretty much indubitable and as such is almost impossible to fake.

I'll try and get back to you on this tomorrow, I have to go to bed to get up early tomorrow for once, despite the fact I'm off work - same with the EU thread

Night

Looking forward to it.

Sleep tight.

I didn't say that human rights was all bad. I'd just prefer to see the prison budget spent on more important things such as schools and hospitals. I don't recall who told me, thus I have no reference, but when people in prison are being fed better than school children eating school dinners, something I wring I think...

More is spent per meal on prison meals vs school meals, but then when you compare the number of school children to the number of prisoners, you'll appreciate the difference between the actual size of the two budgets.

True but human rights are law and theres also that right of equality under the law so unless stated so in law prisoners are no exception to them and maybe those percieved to be least deserving of rights shout loudest when they are violated. You do have to remember they are people who are deorived of thier freedom and is less effective than people deem it to be. Treating people like [LIFTED] helps nought for reoffending. For dangerous criminals and violent criminals im in favour of incarceration but for lesser crimes i'm in favour of more usage of alternative sentancing with jail sentancing being back up for chronic offenders.

nope, if they want entertainment then they should be given 30ft of chain, 10 shovels and picks and a dirt overgrown road



well the current system of seems to be working great in respect to reoffending

you do the crime, you do the time.................simple

Nice.

Unfortunately for that viewpoint, eloquent though it was, like I wrote last night, Broadmoor is not a prison.

It is a secure hospital.

Now unless you object to any hospital whatsoever having games consoles IMO you're being rather hypocritical.

Just in case it got missed again, Broadmoor is a hospital not a prison.

The question is, is prison there for punishment or rehabilitation

Personally I think it should be both

When HK is made supreme ruler I will ask her to change the law to

Person gets a sentence say 1 year

1/3 is punishment (4 months) – Spartan conditions, breaking rocks, etc
1/3 is rehabilitation (4 months) – Community service, education, life skills ect with access to TV, (controlled) internet etc
1/3 is allowed for time off if good behaviour – but must be earned e.g. pass an exam etc

My reasoning behind this is that if you do something wrong you get punished but I want someone who comes out to have a skill / help towards not getting back into crime