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The "golden age of home ownership" is over 
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l3v1ck wrote:
The golden age of home ownership is not over. What's over is the golden age of stupidity, ie people who borrow against the value of their home. You still have to pay it back from your wages or you lose the house! It won't be covered by price rises in the future. We're being taken back to the days when a house was bought to be a home, not an investment.

Yes but I do not think that property values will get back to these levels for maybe 15 or twenty years, so if I am right the golden age will clearly be over.

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:17 am
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I plan on selling my house for profit when it reaches peak value. I shall then turn into a gnome and live in the forests, where I will have no need of a roof and can spend my wealth on fairy dust.

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:20 am
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Amnesia10 wrote:
big_D wrote:
In my girlfriend's family, only the youngest generation (18 to 25) rent, the rest all have their own homes. I rented when I first came here, it is certainly more flexible, you aren't as restricted when it comes to work, you can just up and move in a couple of months, you don't have to try and sell the old house and find a new one to buy.

I don't know what the percentages are in Germany, but I would think they are certainly much higher for rented accomodation, than in the UK.

I think that the proportion renting is much higher. It used to be that you really only managed to buy once you were in your late thirties in Germany, such was the cost. Though renting was never the stigma that it was here.

Yes, renting has no real stigma, unless you are among the super-rich; although, looking at the property programmes, some people are renting for over 2,000€ a month. Our house wasn't cheap, but it also wasn't expensive (although the 30K I paid out for renovations certainly added a big wodge to what we gave out!). Some areas have prices around the 40-50K level for a small house, whilst München, Frankfurt and Berlin are much higher (from renting, I was paying 1,500€ a month in München, I got a bigger flat in Bramsche, but it only cost 250€ a month, a house like ours, but in the München area would have cost about 3 times as much).

It depends on where you are. Here, 140-190K gets you a decent one family house (detached). Semi-detached is much rarer here (mainly only in the city centre), as most people build their own house - although many families build "more generation" houses, where the house is split up into smaller houses or flats for the children and grandchildren. But they are then hard to rent or sell on, because they usually have connecting doors.

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Last edited by big_D on Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:10 am, edited 1 time in total.



Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:51 am
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In Switzerland the numbers renting is much higher, around 80% I think.

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 4:45 am
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I don't see a stigma about renting. I just think its a waste of money and that you can't do what you want as it isn't yours. Plus you can be booted out if they sell up.

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:41 am
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l3v1ck wrote:
I don't see a stigma about renting. I just think its a waste of money and that you can't do what you want as it isn't yours. Plus you can be booted out if they sell up.


But with the benefit that it's cheaper. I couldn't afford the mortgage on my place.

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 8:35 am
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tombolt wrote:
l3v1ck wrote:
I don't see a stigma about renting. I just think its a waste of money and that you can't do what you want as it isn't yours. Plus you can be booted out if they sell up.


But with the benefit that it's cheaper. I couldn't afford the mortgage on my place.


Benefit? What benefit. My mortgage has always been around the same price as renting properties in my area.

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 8:37 am
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tombolt wrote:
l3v1ck wrote:
I don't see a stigma about renting. I just think its a waste of money and that you can't do what you want as it isn't yours. Plus you can be booted out if they sell up.


But with the benefit that it's cheaper. I couldn't afford the mortgage on my place.

It was only cheaper for me because I rented a smaller house in a not so good area. For the house I have now, in the same area, the rent would be almost the same as my mortgage (admittedly I did have a 30% deposit saved).

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 10:28 am
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oceanicitl wrote:
Benefit? What benefit. My mortgage has always been around the same price as renting properties in my area.


Maybe you have a small mortgage, I can't imagine you can get a £260,000 mortgage for £695 a month.

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:14 pm
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How can you still have a golden age when you need more than 6 times average earnings to buy anywhere? More in some places.

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:24 pm
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Amnesia10 wrote:
How can you still have a golden age when you need more than 6 times average earnings to buy anywhere? More in some places.

But it is, and always will be, the same. Buy in the right place at the right time, people have to be open to looking beyond the surrounding 2 streets.

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Thu Aug 19, 2010 7:57 pm
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oceanicitl wrote:
tombolt wrote:
l3v1ck wrote:
I don't see a stigma about renting. I just think its a waste of money and that you can't do what you want as it isn't yours. Plus you can be booted out if they sell up.


But with the benefit that it's cheaper. I couldn't afford the mortgage on my place.


Benefit? What benefit. My mortgage has always been around the same price as renting properties in my area.

Same for me, my first house was cheaper than renting and my current house is about the same, or slightly less than renting a similar sized house.

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Fri Aug 20, 2010 4:08 am
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Amnesia10 wrote:
l3v1ck wrote:
The golden age of home ownership is not over. What's over is the golden age of stupidity, ie people who borrow against the value of their home. You still have to pay it back from your wages or you lose the house! It won't be covered by price rises in the future. We're being taken back to the days when a house was bought to be a home, not an investment.

Yes but I do not think that property values will get back to these levels for maybe 15 or twenty years, so if I am right the golden age will clearly be over.
No way. The population is shooting up and houses are being built at the slowest pace since the 1920's. Supply and demand. As the economy picks up over the next five years prices will shoot up again. I expect a five year price stability before this happens. No way will it be fifteen.

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Fri Aug 20, 2010 6:43 am
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The population may be shooting up and more people will be living alone as a result of divorce. Though that does not necessarily mean an increase in housing demand. People might move in with others to save money. Household formation will be delayed.

Don't forget that there will be a million government workers on the dole, they could become forced sellers, driving down prices. Then there will be another half a million private sector jobs lost because of government cut backs, they will also reduce demand for homes. Also factor in the majority of people are in trouble financially so will be saving rather than moving to bigger homes. Then add in the multitudes who have their hours cut.

Then businesses are also burdened with big debts so will not be able to increase wages or lend money. The banks will also not want to lend to anyone who does not have a large deposit. This has been a financial recession not an ordinary one. That means that debts will need to be reduced before there is any chance of a recovery. The Bank of England has pumped billions of funds into the banks to support mortgages and eventually this effort will fail. The US have been doing this and while prices stabilised for a while they are about to fall another 20%. Then as austerity bites the migrants will return home, and even Brits will consider a move abroad. House prices require a growing economy and credit growth and since most will suffer falling wages as a result of austerity measure and inflation that then the ability of banks to lend will fall. It will be a slow and steady fall, very much like Japan, but not as severe.

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Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:25 am
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I do want us to own our own home at some point in the future, but right now renting is right for us. We don't have a lot of money saved and if anything major were to go wrong in our house, it's our landlords responsibility to fix it, not ours. We couldn't get a mortgage for the amount we pay monthly, especially not since it includes all our bills, and we have a lot of freedom to do as we please. We love the house and the location and wouldn't move anywhere unless we could achieve a similar standard.

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Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:34 am
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