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Do you believe? 

Do you?
Yes 19%  19%  [ 6 ]
No 29%  29%  [ 9 ]
Maybe 39%  39%  [ 12 ]
Cheese Pie 13%  13%  [ 4 ]
Total votes : 31

Do you believe? 
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F_A_F wrote:
If you believe in evolution, in all liklihood due to the wealth of evidence for it, why do you believe in an initial intelligent "creator" who started the whole process? What first triggered that belief in your mind? Actual experience which led to an individual belief unrelated to dogmatic prompting, or was it studying the beliefs of others and taking on their beliefs without an evidential basis?


Parents were never particularly religious and neither was I. Even now, I say I'm about as religious as a monkey. But despite science's findings, theories and laws, I find them, for lack of a better word, "unfulfilling". For me, science is all about the how and not the why.

Example:
"why did the chicken cross the road?"
Scientific answer - a stimulus (eg sight of food, mate etc) initiated a series of synaptic discharges resulting in the release of acetylcholine at the neuromuscular junction, initiating muscle contraction, caused the chicken's legs to move and it crossed the road.
This tells me how but not why.

For me, the why is something beyond the comprehension of science. Why are we here*? I personally believe that the entire of 'creation' (this 'verse as well as all the others) is beyond any accident. The scientific evidence is enough for me to understand why I keep getting weeds in the garden, but not enough to convince me everything was an 'accident' or 'just happened'. I also believe this 'creator/god/allah/krishna/jesus/whatever' is beyond the comprehension of any human mind and thus beyond scientific experimentation. You cannot perform an experiment if you don't know what it is you're testing.







*NB A singularity exploding into particles then fusing together to form atoms, then elements, which later started to coalesce into larger elements and molecules, lead to the formation of suns, with the remaining matter coalescing into planets, one of which is Earth, where a primordial ooze formed amino acids and thence into RNA and DNA, the latter of which allowed the propogation of material that coded for the creation of basic lifeforms later, through evolution, developed into humans is not why, it's how.

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Sun Jun 14, 2009 5:15 pm
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leeds_manc wrote:
Yes, lying.


That's quite a lie, with lots of independent documented evidence. :?

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Sun Jun 14, 2009 5:50 pm
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cloaked_wolf wrote:
F_A_F wrote:
If you believe in evolution, in all liklihood due to the wealth of evidence for it, why do you believe in an initial intelligent "creator" who started the whole process? What first triggered that belief in your mind? Actual experience which led to an individual belief unrelated to dogmatic prompting, or was it studying the beliefs of others and taking on their beliefs without an evidential basis?


Parents were never particularly religious and neither was I. Even now, I say I'm about as religious as a monkey. But despite science's findings, theories and laws, I find them, for lack of a better word, "unfulfilling". For me, science is all about the how and not the why.

Example:
"why did the chicken cross the road?"
Scientific answer - a stimulus (eg sight of food, mate etc) initiated a series of synaptic discharges resulting in the release of acetylcholine at the neuromuscular junction, initiating muscle contraction, caused the chicken's legs to move and it crossed the road.
This tells me how but not why.

For me, the why is something beyond the comprehension of science. Why are we here*? I personally believe that the entire of 'creation' (this 'verse as well as all the others) is beyond any accident. The scientific evidence is enough for me to understand why I keep getting weeds in the garden, but not enough to convince me everything was an 'accident' or 'just happened'. I also believe this 'creator/god/allah/krishna/jesus/whatever' is beyond the comprehension of any human mind and thus beyond scientific experimentation. You cannot perform an experiment if you don't know what it is you're testing.







*NB A singularity exploding into particles then fusing together to form atoms, then elements, which later started to coalesce into larger elements and molecules, lead to the formation of suns, with the remaining matter coalescing into planets, one of which is Earth, where a primordial ooze formed amino acids and thence into RNA and DNA, the latter of which allowed the propogation of material that coded for the creation of basic lifeforms later, through evolution, developed into humans is not why, it's how.


Actually the 'why' in the example is because it wanted the food/mate which was at the other side of the road to fulfill a need

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Sun Jun 14, 2009 7:09 pm
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Okay, it was a poor example, but it's a bit difficult trying to get across what my thoughts are.

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cloaked_wolf wrote:
Okay, it was a poor example, but it's a bit difficult trying to get across what my thoughts are.


Perhaps a better example might be;

"Why is the chicken"

Perhaps you'd give an evolutionary answer to how the chicken came to be, fitting an ecological niche in the developing ecosystem. That still doesn't completely say "why" - just "how it evolved from a specific starting point".

This is a game most little kids play; "but why?"

Eventually all questions of this type lead back to the ultimate question of life, the universe and everything.

I think God was invented by frustrated parents. "Because God said so! Now shut up and eat your greens or you'll go to hell."

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No.

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I believe childrean are our future and that I can fly. :D

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Mon Jun 15, 2009 8:53 am
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I can't answer a straightforward yes or no, because it isn't that clear cut.

Aliens/UFOs.

I am always reminded of the song from Monty Python's The Meaning of Life, which is pretty accurate. "Our galaxy itself contains one hundred billion (100,000,000,000) stars" and "our galaxy is only one of millions of billions....."

So, there are eight planets orbiting our sun (star). Before someone sees fit to comment on this- remember that Pluto has been downgraded. So, not every star necessarily has planets, so lets say an average of four per star. That's four hundred billion stars in the Milky Way alone. No matter how long the odds on life appearing on any planet- whether like Earth or more like Mars for example, does anyone- apart from creationists - actually think that we are alone if not in our galaxy, but in the entire universe. I certainly don't and neither do many scientists who study these things.

Ghosts.

Many people have seen something. Was it mist, a trick of the light or really the spirit of a dead person. At the end of the day, I have never seen anything of the like, but my wife has and has heard many more tales of ghostly figures and lights in the wards and corridors of the hospital where she works. There is something in it, but I would say that my mind is open, but I truly don't know.

Giant anacondas, strange beasties etc. living on Earth.

Yes, I believe that there are many things out there that we don't understand or which are not scientifically proven to exist- particularly in the oceans of the world. Remember that we know more about space than we do about our own oceans and have found south American indian tribes lost to the rest of the world for thousands of years.

Strange phenomenon like the Bermuda Triangle and stuff

I have seen programs regarding many natural phenomena that can cause ships to simply sink into the depths a (the name escapes me) and so tales such as the Bermuda Triangle may have solid grounding in natural phenomena. I don't know.

So- My mind is open to the possibilities of almost anything but I have not seen anything myself related to any of these types of "mystery".

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Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:07 am
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Yes.

:lol:

Simple answer. Do you think that we are the only type of born intelligence there is?

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Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:09 am
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Pie.

I don't believe or disbelieve. If you can't prove it either way (or where's not advanced enough to prove it) then I'm fairly open minded about it.

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mebbz

UFOs - gotta be something else out there
Ghosts - i dont believe religion, as such no after life and no ghosts
God - see above
Yeti - dont see why not, from a biological standpoint. obviously not talking ones like in Monsters. Inc, just big snow beasties
Nessy - same as above, biologically i dont see why not, but is there actually a nessy? i dont think so
Bermuda Triangle etc - i do believe, as such, but i think they are caused by the properties of the area, rather than some strange ethereal force

but, i would happily believe any of the above if i saw it with my own eyes, along with sufficient scientific proof, and a signed legal document from the anomaly itself :wink:


Mon Jun 15, 2009 7:48 pm
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soddit112 wrote:
but, i would happily believe any of the above if i saw it with my own eyes, along with sufficient scientific proof, and a signed legal document from the anomaly itself :wink:


:lol: :lol:

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Tue Jun 16, 2009 8:43 am
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soddit112 wrote:
mebbz

UFOs - gotta be something else out there
You'd have thought...

Ghosts - i dont believe religion, as such no after life and no ghosts
What have ghosts got to do with religion? Is it not possible that after the physical body dies some form of energy is released which manifests itself as what we call ghosts? Having seen "something" and having had a "tapping on the shoulder in an empty room" experience I couldn't simply dismiss the possibly that ghosts exist.

God - see above
Again, what does god have to do with religion? :lol: Is it possible that there is a "supreme being" - possibly an alien - and religion is basically a set of rules which were invented to keep the masses, (humans) from rebelling? It's just an idea...

Yeti - dont see why not, from a biological standpoint. obviously not talking ones like in Monsters. Inc, just big snow beasties
Nessy - same as above, biologically i dont see why not, but is there actually a nessy? i dont think so
Bermuda Triangle etc - i do believe, as such, but i think they are caused by the properties of the area, rather than some strange ethereal force

but, i would happily believe any of the above if i saw it with my own eyes, along with sufficient scientific proof, and a signed legal document from the anomaly itself :wink:


Can't argure with the rest of it... Well, I could, I suppose, but I'll resist ;)

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Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:02 am
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masons worship aliens :) so lol....

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brataccas wrote:
masons worship aliens :) so lol....


Ever watched Stargate? the ancient Egyptians worshipped aliens...

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