It's Labour's turn to self destruct today.

And the other side of the house, Lima Fox has announced he is going to stand for Tory Leader.

Liam Fox, Prime Minister. Jesus effing wept.

Well that was virtually bound to happen almost regardless of the referendum result.
A significant proportion of the PLP have been itching to pull the trigger on a new Leadership contest since Corbyn won the last one.

The thing I don't get is 'what do they expect to happen differently'? If Corbyn is on the ballot paper he'll win by a massive margin again and all they'll do is hand him more power. Make no mistake, in this game, you win or you die. if Corbyn wins again, a good few of them can expect to be deselected in four years time if they don't get immediately expelled.

If they don't let Corbyn onto the ballot paper, the internal fall out between the PLP and the party rank and file will be spectacular and probably fatal for the party.

I actually don't see a scenario in this where the Blairites can win. I assume they think if they get a Blairite leader elected the party membership will just fall into line and everything will carry on as before. The reality is that's the least likely thing that will happen.

It's an enormous act of hubris based on entitlement and the assumption the party is there to forward their interests, rather than the rank &a files. I think they're going to get a massive shock if not in the next few months, then at the next general election. They could come out of it as irrelevant as the LibDems.

Just caught up with The Last Leg... it's not hard to see where Boris got his schtick from.

I don't disagree Jon. The problem is that Corbyn hasn't been willing to really go to the mat with the PLP to lay down the law and there's no real indication he's going to change that position.

Corbyn still gives the impression he can't quite believe he won. While I fundamentally disagree with most of his opponents in the PLP they aren't wrong that whoever the leader is needs to actually be electable to a broader audience than just Labour Party members/supporters. Principle is important but if you have no power to implement your policies they are effectively meaningless.
Labour needs a bold, engaging leader and leadership team that's prepared to think outside the box and is able to actually talk to people who genuinely feel they've been abandoned by the party that should represent them. I voted for Corbyn in the leadership election but I have to say unless there is a radical change in his behaviour it doesn't look terribly promising for the future. Unfortunately I have no idea if there's a better left candidate who could do what's necessary.

I know what you mean. It did however strike me though that by banging on about how everything could be solved by cricket he'd effectively conceded that Scotland was off.

He's definitely been trying to be a consensus leader than a dictatorial one. Either way, that's not going to survive this. If he stays, there's no possibility of his supporters and the Blairites 'getting on'. Today's events have conclusively proved this. If he goes, he's a going to take a big lump of the party with him.

I can't see how the party as it stands can survive this. There' going to be a split, it seems inevitable.


Thing is, there's nobody in the PLP who fits that requirement. The vast majority of the PLP are grey, careerist politicians who the public wouldn't trust to tell them the time. None of the people in the PLP who are revolting against Corbyn stand a cat in hell's chance of being the next prime minister.


Agreed, principle without power is futile. But power without principle is no better. The poster child for that is sodding Boris Johnson, and is anyone going to stand up and declare he'll be a competent PM? Look at him, even he doesn't think he will.



Yes, but I"m afraid that's a pipe dream at the moment. The PLP doesn't have anyone who can do that - the constituency results of the referendum show that. We've got a leader who has principle and is engaging but has no real leadership skills being ousted by a bunch of people whose skill list is 'none of the above' yet who for some unknown reason think they're what the party actually needs & wants.

Just look at Heidi Alexander, for example. Shadow health secretary. We've just had the longest and most divisive industrial dispute in the history of the health service in this country and can anyone actually remember her doing anything noteworthy at all? She's claiming Corbyn isn't good enough, when she herself is a complete non-entity.


There possibly is but your can bet your arse that whoever they are the PLP won't let them within a mile of the ballot paper. Any such person isn't going to stand against Corbyn because that would just split the vote and they're not going to get past the Blairites if Corbyn isn't there. The leadership vote, if it happens, will either be Corbyn vs Blairites or just Blairites, the PLP will see to that. And in the process they'll either sign their own suicide notes or make the Labour Party irrelevant for the next decade.

None of the people who stood against Corbyn last time are actually any more 'electable' than he is, they're just less offensive to some people because they're all utterly bland. However if anyone thinks this means the MSM will do anything other than figuratively burn them at the stake in four year's time anyway they're delusional. Also if the referendum has taught us anything, it's that the public have no longer got any time for bland, careerist politicians. They're just too stupid to realise they're obsolete.

Time to find a job back home in Scotland me thinks.
The way things seem to be going I'd probably end up being deported for being ginger anyway.

It's been pointed out to me that the referendum was 'advisory' and not legally binding.

Question.....

What if the Tories vote in a new leader who says 'We're going to ignore the results and stay in'?
It could happen.

I have been telling people this but they just do not seem to get it.
The really smart thing David Cameron has done is deferred the Article 50 declaration until there's a new PM in office.
Either way, the new PM is screwed. Risk an internal revolt if article 50 isn't invoked, or risk a country in economic turmoil for many years to come if it is.
It was a very shrewd move by David Cameron to pass all that on to his successor, whoever that may be.

Mark

Conservative leadership rift opens as Brexit recriminations begin | Politics | The Guardian
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... ens-brexit

Every image of Boris looks like he walked away from a major car crash he caused on a busy motorway, somewhat appropriately.

It'll basically be a competition to see who's the least smelliest of all the turds. I think it's hilarious that they've all gone into hiding, it just tells you everything you need to know if you didn't already.

If the Tories did that, I think they would not be back in power for a long time. LibDem have been trying to jump on that boat


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The car crash hasn't even happened yet. And he'll probably be at the wheel when it does. But now the only way he can stop it is to chuck himself out the window at 70MPH.

He knows this. You can see it.

Yes, although it would be possible to ignore the result it would be total suicide for the Tories. They'd be swept from power by UKIP who wouldn't bother with any referendums, invoking article 50 would be job 1 as soon as they were in power.
Much as I detest the Tories I really don't want UKIP stepping into the shoes of an actual potential party of government. I suspect, with one definite exception, I'm not the only person on here who feels that way.