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What are Apple doing?
http://www.x404.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1402		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  big_D [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 7:30 am ]
Post subject:  What are Apple doing?
I'm getting really confused with the new MacBook Pro line...

They've upgraded the processors, but then they have downgraded the video on the 15" MBP. :?

They've crippled the SATA controller, dropping back to SATA 1, so throughput reduced (not really a problem as the drives can't overload it anyway), but that also means optimisation of access through NCQ won't be available. :?

They've given the 13" MBP FireWire 800, but they removed digital audio in and the audio out is now analogue out, digital out or analogue in... That means that you can't use a headset for chatting - you can either use the inbuilt microphone and headphones, or an external microphone and the inbuilt speakers - or use a bluetooth headset.

I'm really starting to consider a MBP as a replacement laptop - it is getting frustrating being at my girlfriend's and not having my e-mail etc. to hand. But the current generation seems really strange... :?
Author:  gavomatic57 [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 11:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
There was an article in the Register today - they've begrudgingly released a new firmware update to allow SATA 2 speeds, although the drives fitted are SATA1. What this means is that you can install an SSD when they reach reasonable prices and not be penalised.

http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2009/06/23/apple_macbook_3gbits/
Author:  big_D [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
That's good news. But why are they using SATA 1 drives? They are slower and don't support NCQ... :?
Author:  saspro [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
I bet they got a load of sata1 drives cheap from a supplier as no-one else in the world wants them.
Author:  Linux_User [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
saspro wrote:
I bet they got a load of sata1 drives cheap from a supplier as no-one else in the world wants them.


Does that explain the low-end gfx cards as well?

*runs*
Author:  HeatherKay [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
Linux_User wrote:
Does that explain the low-end gfx cards as well?


I hear this a lot, but low-end by what standards?

For example, I've don't think I've ever managed to overtax my MBP or iMac's low-end graphics card. If it's adequate for the job, why install something that will eat more energy for little benefit?
Author:  Linux_User [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
HeatherKay wrote:
Linux_User wrote:
Does that explain the low-end gfx cards as well?


I hear this a lot, but low-end by what standards?

For example, I've don't think I've ever managed to overtax my MBP or iMac's low-end graphics card. If it's adequate for the job, why install something that will eat more energy for little benefit?


I don't know, some crazy people might like the idea of playing games on their £1,000+ PC, especially since they can now run software released by the Evil Empire. *shrugs*
Author:  big_D [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
That was the biggest contradication at the WWDC.

They announce that Snow Leopaprd will be able to make use of the unused graphics power for "normal" calculations, then in the next breath announce that they have removed the graphics chipset from the MBPs (13" and the lower spec 15") and all of the other machines (iMac, Mac Pro) will either have no separate graphics chip or the cheapest, bottom of the range graphics chip that they could find...

Surely if openCL is such a wonderful thing, Apple should be making it a mass market product, not reducing the number of machines that can good use of it... :?

OpenCL seems to suggest that they should be looking at the 260GTX or better, not the 120 or the 9400/9600...
Author:  gavomatic57 [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
The 9400m can technically be used for OpenCL, but it won't be as fast as the top end cards...better than nothing I guess.

The biggest contradiction is with Grand Central - better optimisation of cores...great, but it's probably a lot easier to balance two cores than 4 or 8, but how many mac users have a mac pro?
Author:  gavomatic57 [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
big_D wrote:
That's good news. But why are they using SATA 1 drives? They are slower and don't support NCQ... :?


This is true, but they only spin at 5400rpm anyway, so I can't imagine it making a huge difference. Looking at the Novatech website, a lot of the 2.5" hard drives they sell are still SATA1. It is SSD's where SATA1 will cause the problem and I'm glad the regression was only a firmware thing. Makes me a bit less dubious about buying one, although I'm watching twitter carefully for the comments - a lot of "my macbook is dead" popping up...
Author:  big_D [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
I know the 9400m can be used for openCL, but, considering ALL the old MBPs had a dedicated graphics chip, capable of so much more under openCL, it seems a crazy move to then castrate them, when openCL is ready for release...
Author:  paulzolo [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 7:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
gavomatic57 wrote:
but how many mac users have a mac pro?


Raises hand. Gingerly.
Author:  gavomatic57 [ Tue Jun 23, 2009 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
paulzolo wrote:
gavomatic57 wrote:
but how many mac users have a mac pro?


Raises hand. Gingerly.


I didn't know you were ginger!?! ;)
Author:  rubicon [ Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
gavomatic57 wrote:
The biggest contradiction is with Grand Central - better optimisation of cores...great, but it's probably a lot easier to balance two cores than 4 or 8, but how many mac users have a mac pro?


Don't forget, Snow Leopard is a re-write (more or less) of the whole OS and will form the basis of Apple's software for years to come. I don't think they were looking at "now" with this project, they were looking years ahead and taking future hardware into consideration.
Author:  HeatherKay [ Wed Jun 24, 2009 5:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: What are Apple doing?
gavomatic57 wrote:
I didn't know you were ginger!?! ;)


Quote me potentially ginger, because I'm definitely planning a Mac Pro this year.

Strangely, in order to future proof it, I'm looking at the biggest, baddest mother of a gfx card Apple will supply.

If I can afford it. :cry:
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