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l3v1ck
What's a life?
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:21 am Posts: 12700 Location: The Right Side of the Pennines (metaphorically & geographically)
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+1 That's another thing I have about Labour. Rather than debating things, they mock and marginalise anyone who has an opinion different to theirs. I find myself hating Labour on every level. The Lib Dems on the other hand, I don't like their policies, but I've nothing against the way they conduct themselves.
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Wed May 05, 2010 9:00 am |
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jonlumb
Spends far too much time on here
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:44 pm Posts: 4141 Location: Exeter
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Agreed, wholeheartedly. I'll probably end up voting Conservative, but more due to a desire to get rid of Ben Bradshaw than anything else. I'm certainly no fan of Cameron, although I have to say I'm not as phased by the thought of a hung parliament as most people, I think too many politicians have got far too used to having their own way, will be good to make them compromise and talk rather than just bicker incesantly.
_________________ "The woman is a riddle inside a mystery wrapped in an enigma I've had sex with."
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Wed May 05, 2010 9:02 am |
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HeatherKay
Moderator
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:13 pm Posts: 7262 Location: Here, but not all there.
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I fully expect we'll get a Tory MP this time round. To her credit, the candidate has been working hard in the constituency for a couple of years, and good luck to her.
My problem is I don't find the Conservatives fit my world view. I also worry that there's a thin veneer of "niceness" that's been laid over them to make people feel comfortable voting for them, which will chip away as soon as Cameron and his crew are safely behind the black door in Downing Street.
It's all about "change" but all I see is more of the same.
I firmly believe this country needs electoral reform, and it needs it now. The expenses scandal, the way the House of Commons has been left as nothing more than a rubber stamp for policy from the executive, and the way that my vote has counted for absolutely nothing in the past three decades with all the elections being decided by the million voters who happen to live in marginal constituencies, all of that needs to be sorted out.
The Conservatives have no truck with proportional representation. Their Big Idea is to reduce the number of MPs, which coincidentally will just bolster their margin of the vote. We need more than that if our democracy is to survive.
_________________My Flickr | Snaptophobic BloggageHeather Kay: modelling details that matter. "Let my windows be open to receive new ideas but let me also be strong enough not to be blown away by them." - Mahatma Gandhi.
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Wed May 05, 2010 9:13 am |
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l3v1ck
What's a life?
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:21 am Posts: 12700 Location: The Right Side of the Pennines (metaphorically & geographically)
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I find that true of all politicians. That's why I try to look at written policies rather than the politicians telling me about them. They do have a point when it comes to Scottish MP's voting on English only issues. Labour have not done anything as it means they get more votes even if it is unfair. Other parties have suggested a separate English parliament, which is just another waste of money and a pointless layer of paperwork. The Tory solution of English MP's only to vote on English only matters in Westminster seems fast, cheap and fair to me.
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Wed May 05, 2010 9:16 am |
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Amnesia10
Legend
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 2:02 am Posts: 29240 Location: Guantanamo Bay (thanks bobbdobbs)
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The tories will stuff the general public like they always have and will cut spending to enable them to give tax cuts to the rich. There is no further planning than that. The Right to Buy policy of council homes was pure gerry-mandering in that home owners are more likely to vote Tory, nothing about creating a new dynamic. Why do you think Westminster council boarded up homes in marginal wards to sell them to engineer a social switch away from Labour wards to Conservative.
_________________Do concentrate, 007... "You are gifted. Mine is bordering on seven seconds." https://www.dropbox.com/referrals/NTg5MzczNTkhttp://astore.amazon.co.uk/wwwx404couk-21
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Wed May 05, 2010 9:51 am |
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tombolt
Spends far too much time on here
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:38 am Posts: 2967 Location: Dorchester, Dorset
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God yeah. We can't have spending cuts. We need to spend, spend, spend. I can't wait until public spending is 100% of GDP. It's just not ruinous enough at the moment!
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Wed May 05, 2010 10:36 am |
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l3v1ck
What's a life?
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:21 am Posts: 12700 Location: The Right Side of the Pennines (metaphorically & geographically)
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A well made point. All three parties say they'll make massive spending cuts. The only difference is that Labour/Lib Dems are making it sound like the Tories ones are much bigger when in fact they're just coming earlier. All three have to balance tax rises and budget cuts. All three will have to do both. Public sector jobs will go no matter what.
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Wed May 05, 2010 10:57 am |
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HeatherKay
Moderator
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:13 pm Posts: 7262 Location: Here, but not all there.
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I think the LibDems' numbers given in their manifesto have stood up to most scrutiny. As far as I can tell, the others haven't given many figures. Whichever, we're in for a tough time over the coming years. 
_________________My Flickr | Snaptophobic BloggageHeather Kay: modelling details that matter. "Let my windows be open to receive new ideas but let me also be strong enough not to be blown away by them." - Mahatma Gandhi.
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Wed May 05, 2010 11:01 am |
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Amnesia10
Legend
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 2:02 am Posts: 29240 Location: Guantanamo Bay (thanks bobbdobbs)
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I am not against spending cuts. I just think that we need to raise taxes as well. The Tories will opt for VAT because it is the most regressive and has the least impact on the rich. I would prefer a restoration of the link between income tax rate and capital gains taxes. Also wouldn't most people prefer a higher income tax and fewer taxes elsewhere, like insurance or on pensions, with maybe higher personal allowances?
_________________Do concentrate, 007... "You are gifted. Mine is bordering on seven seconds." https://www.dropbox.com/referrals/NTg5MzczNTkhttp://astore.amazon.co.uk/wwwx404couk-21
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Wed May 05, 2010 11:18 am |
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tombolt
Spends far too much time on here
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:38 am Posts: 2967 Location: Dorchester, Dorset
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When people say punish the rich, I just read it as jealousy. I read an interesting article recently which said to do away with all tax other than VAT.
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Wed May 05, 2010 11:20 am |
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jonlumb
Spends far too much time on here
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:44 pm Posts: 4141 Location: Exeter
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That unfortunately does severely favour the rich, because lower down the income bracket people spend 90% plus of their income, whereas higher up the income scale they save a vast amount more.
_________________ "The woman is a riddle inside a mystery wrapped in an enigma I've had sex with."
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Wed May 05, 2010 11:21 am |
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John_Vella
I haven't seen my friends in so long
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 7:55 am Posts: 7935 Location: Manchester.
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The only thing that surprises me about the current campaign is that none of the major parties have pledged to ban Icelandic volcanoes. 
_________________John Vella BSc (Hons), PGCE - Still the official forum prankster and crude remarker  Sorry  I'll behave now. Promise 
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Wed May 05, 2010 11:23 am |
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Amnesia10
Legend
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 2:02 am Posts: 29240 Location: Guantanamo Bay (thanks bobbdobbs)
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Obviously you are a multi-millionaire and hate the thought of even paying your fair share! 
_________________Do concentrate, 007... "You are gifted. Mine is bordering on seven seconds." https://www.dropbox.com/referrals/NTg5MzczNTkhttp://astore.amazon.co.uk/wwwx404couk-21
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Wed May 05, 2010 11:31 am |
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tombolt
Spends far too much time on here
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:38 am Posts: 2967 Location: Dorchester, Dorset
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The idea was that you would have different amounts of VAT on different types of goods. Certain goods, as now, would have no VAT on them. Luxury goods would have higher VAT. One benefit was that it would be harder to avoid the tax. That said, people could obviously go to any EU country for all their luxury goods and I've no doubt we'd end up with a thriving black market. I just really have an issue with the idea of punishing people for success, but then "toff-bashing" seems to be all the rage these days.
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Wed May 05, 2010 11:35 am |
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jonlumb
Spends far too much time on here
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:44 pm Posts: 4141 Location: Exeter
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Thing is, if we were to go on about "fair share", we'd have one blanket tax rate for everyone, not a bracketted system like we do have. Any system with higher tax rates is already inherently unfair on the wealthy, as they end up paying a greater proportion of their income in.
_________________ "The woman is a riddle inside a mystery wrapped in an enigma I've had sex with."
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Wed May 05, 2010 11:35 am |
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