http://www.channel4.com/news/students-f ... -of-50-000


I feel really sorry for the students of today when my generation benefited from free education but are too tight fisted to pay for their kids generation.

reasons like this that make me happy i never went to uni, so much pressure to do well in your chosen course and come out with top marks because otherwise you just gained a hell of a lot of debt for nothing, and even then your not guarenteed to find a decent job..

what are we to do

I never got to go to University (late 80s), because it was simply too expensive. I couldn't get a grant, as my (divorced) parents earnt too much - the government calculations didn't take into account, that they had to pay for 2 houses and that my father had remarried and had to look after 3 step children.

The only way was to get a student loan, so I got a job instead.

I thankfully didn't have to pay much in the way of tuition fees, given the amount my parents earned. But it was still a pain to fork out £500-600/yr and then pay accomodation on top of that. I ended up leaving with a debt of around £25k, of which I've paid only £5000. At this rate, it'd take me around another 20 years to pay it off, so I can't imagine how the affected students will be able to pay it off.

In some ways, those degrees that lead to high-earning jobs will be more popular than a degree in hairdressing or whatever, so hopefully some order will be restored. But I still disagree with tuition fees as it'll disadvantage those from poor backgrounds. Current estimates are that medical students will have debts of £100,000 or so, not including the interest that will be accrued given that the majority won't be in a position to pay it off for 10-20 years after completing the degree.

That's the one good thing about low interest rates, my loans were taken out at the end of the 90's and are linked to the interest rate so I've been in the odd position of having a small part of my loan paid off each month without me having to spend any cash.

And it will take you years to save up to buy into a practice if planning to be a GP. The whole degree scam needs to end otherwise good academic courses like History or Geology could suffer, as there are only a few high paying jobs in these fields. I would rather we go back to free degrees but based on merit. If you are rich enough you should pay. For most that should mean fewer graduates but no debts, and definitely non of this commercial loans.

[quote="Amnesia10"]
And it will take you years to save up to buy into a practice if planning to be a GP./[quote]
Probably and that's if I become a partner. If I go into a salaried position, it becomes more of a 8am-6pm clock-on clock-off mentality with no responsibility of running the practice, as well as paid annual leave, study leave etc. If you go into a partnership, you have a parity - ie you draw only a certain amount, which increases to 100% over a period of time. At the moment, if I went into a salaried GP job, my earnings would increase by 1.5-2x. If I went into a partnership, I could draw about 2-3x my current income. I imagine you have to take out a loan to buy into the partnership, otherwise you'd be close to retirement before you could buy into a practice.

This will seriously impact on the future options for medical students. It might be better to emigrate where the pay is better and prospects better. That could harm the NHS. So taking out a huge loan to buy into a practice on top of huge student debts, will drive doctors into the private sector where they can earn enough to pay off these debts and buy a house, with yet more debt. Talk about debt servitude.

A lot have already moved to Australia/New Zealand. A few years back, before I started my specialty training, about half of my cohort had plans to go to OZ/NZ for a gap year. A few have stayed on for longer. The pay is better, doctors aren't undermined as much and our fifth year medical students have more practical abilities than their first year junior doctors. Consequently there's been quite a lot of medical emigration.

Years ago I flatmate of mine was telling me about a poster in Dublin Airport about why to invest in Ireland. It was of a group of graduates from Trinity Dublin, this was meant to encourage inward investment. All but one of the graduates had emigrated. He was one of them.

Of course, if we'd got the £6000 million we're owed by Vodafone, we could have avoided this altogether

Actually do we need so many graduates? I suspect if we cut the numbers and provided free university education for those that need it then that would be much better. A lot cheaper and a no debt for those involved.

That's part of the paradox. We're swimming in graduates in things that we don't actually need and continuing to train more of them but we've got crippling shortages in some subjects that apparently nobody wants to study that you literally can't beg people to do. Throw a stone near a job centre and it'll bounce off half a dozen media studies grads, but can you find an electrical engineering grad when you need one?

I kind of feel sorry for them. They're being sold the idea that of you go to University you'll get a decent job, when in a lot cases they'll come out in three years time to find their particular specialisation isn't in demand, they've got 50K of debt and the best they can hope for is something generic (and therefore not very well paid) whereas if they'd done something 'hard science' that we'll be screaming for, they could pretty much name their own price.

Jon

It is worse than that. A good science graduate would be lucky to get a wage above average. And science jobs above £30k are as rare as rocking horse poo. I was at Sussex when Jonathan Hare was Noble prize winner Sir Harry Kroto's assistant. He ended up doing Hollywood Science with Robert Llewellyn, and Rough Science. Probably for a lot more money than actual science pays. That is appalling that someone that talented is forced to look elsewhere for work. the problem is that companies want these qualifications and skills and are unwilling to pay for them or even train someone via an apprenticeship. Look at Germany where they value engineers of all kinds.

I don't know what to think about this tbh. I went to uni in 2003 and the only help I got from anybody was that I didn't have to pay tuition fees due to my parents' income. All I wanted to spend I had to earn. Nobody gave or lent me a penny. I started uni with a grand of savings and I finished with two grand. I had to do pub work during the term. In addition I got myself very good summer experience job after first year and they wanted me back after second too (whilst doing evenings in the pub of course). Even before I had my final exams they offered me a job there. I still work for them btw.

Could it be that students these days feel entitled to get pissed every night of the week, they think they can't work not to "impact" their grades and when they finish they must have a year long vacation travelling the world because they "deserve" it?
Or am I missing something?