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Winter Tyres 
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I drove several cars last winter in Denmark. Winter tyres are astonishingly good when compared to UK summer tyres in winter conditions. All year tyres are adequate, but as you are asking about proper mountain roads and Denmark is as flat as the Duchess of Cambridge, then full winter tyres would be the best option for performance. However if you will be doing a lot of mileage to get there outside of full winter conditions then all-rounders may be the best option.

Drivers in Denmark, as with Germany as BigD mentioned, generally have two sets of wheels and tyres, which are swapped out as required by season/law.

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Sun Sep 23, 2012 10:33 am
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big_D wrote:
okenobi wrote:
Right, I thought "performance" would be more of an issue in Germany. I'm not buying just to satisfy legal requirements, I want my car to actually handle in the cold/snow.

Looks like I'm gonna go for Nokian WR A3s.

I've had Vreddy Sessantas before and they were great, but I'm current on Hankook S1 Evos and they're the best tyres I've ever had (and I've tried every premium brand/model on the Octy over the years). From ADAC and other German tests, I was gonna go with Goodyear Ultragrips, but in my odd size (not buying smaller steelies) they're £140 a corner. The Nokians are almost as good and are £104 a corner. I'll get them fitted locally and stuff my summers in the shed.

Most places supposedly only store your summers for 6 months max anyway, and I probably need 7ish to get me home after the season.

It depends. On a "normal" car or if you aren't doing a lot of Bahstorming, it doesn't make much difference. Most of the branded and "unbranded" tyres from the big manufacturers are good under normal conditions at normal speeds.

Winter tyres are generally limited to 190km/h, which is more than the maximum speed of my car, so getting "performance" winter tyres is, for me, a waste of money. I also do around 95% of my mileage on A and B roads, so I can't get near those limits anyway.

I drove back from Ballingen last year in an A6 Avant Quattro fully loaded and in icy and slushy conditions. The tyres were still good at 240km/h, but in slushy conditions, that isn't a speed I'd be comfortable driving.

To be honest, anything over 180km/h is too stressful on a dry road to keep up for long periods of time. I generally keep it in the 140-150km/h range these days. With the traffic and roadworks on the network these days, going faster doesn't bring much advantage, you just reach the next traffic jam a few minutes earlier...

Also watch out for speed restrictions. Large parts of the network now have severe speed restrictions due to the surface breaking up - they generally put a 120 limit on, then a 100, then 80, when it gets too bad for 80km/h, they will resurface that stretch.

The police are very strict about it as well. Fines increased dramatically this year.


Shouldn't be in Germany until April anyway, so hopefully not an issue. Last May in an S4 we were at 180+ most of the time throughout the South from the 'Ring all the way to Austria.
My car is specified with V or W rated tyres because it's capable of handling high speeds for extended periods. So I want to get the same rating for winter. Not saying I'm gonna be driving at 145mph, but I want the option to not impede the car's performance.


Sun Sep 23, 2012 10:39 am
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We put winter tyres on the vans at work, and I know they did a bit of a trial with lots of different configs, but I can't find any info at the moment.

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Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:24 pm
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big_D wrote:
On our street, which is fairly steep, when it is covered in ice, I couldn't stand on the road, because the ice was so slippery last year. With winter tyres, I could drive up the hill without any wheelspin.

Are those winter tyres studded?

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Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:33 pm
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Amnesia10 wrote:
big_D wrote:
On our street, which is fairly steep, when it is covered in ice, I couldn't stand on the road, because the ice was so slippery last year. With winter tyres, I could drive up the hill without any wheelspin.

Are those winter tyres studded?

I imagine the weight of the car on tyres that are suitably sticky at low temperatures should provide a decent amount of grip. This pdf provides a general overview of the requirements in different countries.

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Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:01 pm
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Amnesia10 wrote:
big_D wrote:
On our street, which is fairly steep, when it is covered in ice, I couldn't stand on the road, because the ice was so slippery last year. With winter tyres, I could drive up the hill without any wheelspin.

Are those winter tyres studded?


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Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:12 pm
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belchingmatt wrote:
Amnesia10 wrote:
big_D wrote:
On our street, which is fairly steep, when it is covered in ice, I couldn't stand on the road, because the ice was so slippery last year. With winter tyres, I could drive up the hill without any wheelspin.

Are those winter tyres studded?


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Thanks for that. Previously the only other winter tyres that I knew about come from my stays in Northern Sweden, where they have studded tyres, which are able drive on snow and ice. As they do not bother clearing the roads, you just drive on the ice. It is only in the summer that you discover that over winter you were driving on a foot of solid ice.

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Sun Sep 23, 2012 3:02 pm
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Amnesia10 wrote:
big_D wrote:
On our street, which is fairly steep, when it is covered in ice, I couldn't stand on the road, because the ice was so slippery last year. With winter tyres, I could drive up the hill without any wheelspin.

Are those winter tyres studded?

No, they are winter tyres, not spiked tyres. Spiked tyres are illegal here.

Interesting, the minimum for Winter Tyres used to be 4mm, now it looks like 1.6mm is allowed? :?

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Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:27 am
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big_D wrote:
Amnesia10 wrote:
big_D wrote:
On our street, which is fairly steep, when it is covered in ice, I couldn't stand on the road, because the ice was so slippery last year. With winter tyres, I could drive up the hill without any wheelspin.

Are those winter tyres studded?

No, they are winter tyres, not spiked tyres. Spiked tyres are illegal here.

Interesting, the minimum for Winter Tyres used to be 4mm, now it looks like 1.6mm is allowed? :?

Well the Swedish winter tyres are not spiked more metal knobs that can grip on ice.

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Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:05 am
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They're called studs.And legislation varies widely across Europe. What I'm buying are essentially winter "sports" tyres. Which is all anybody in central/Western Europe needs for road driving IMO.


Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:48 am
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Not everybody is a boy racer. Perhaps normal winter tyres would suffice for the majority of Northern and Alpine Europe.

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Mon Sep 24, 2012 12:28 pm
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belchingmatt wrote:
Not everybody is a boy racer. Perhaps normal winter tyres would suffice for the majority of Northern and Alpine Europe.


But they're more expensive.


Mon Sep 24, 2012 12:34 pm
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I've never looked into winter tyre costs, but why would winter tyres be more expensive than winter sports tyres? Or perhaps I misunderstood your post. :?

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Mon Sep 24, 2012 1:00 pm
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belchingmatt wrote:
I've never looked into winter tyre costs, but why would winter tyres be more expensive than winter sports tyres? Or perhaps I misunderstood your post. :?

I read the article that you posted a link to and it seems clear that winter tyres do well in lower temperatures otherwise they are have a lower wear resistance, and so a shorter road life if used in the summer. So you need to replace them more often.

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Mon Sep 24, 2012 1:20 pm
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belchingmatt wrote:
I've never looked into winter tyre costs, but why would winter tyres be more expensive than winter sports tyres? Or perhaps I misunderstood your post. :?


Regular winter tyres are for slower speeds and more snow etc. Things like Nokian Hakkas are huge in Finland and Norway and everywhere up that way. But they're more money.

What I've gone for is a more moderate tyre that is rated for higher speeds in cold, wet and snow, but wouldn't be as good in a heavy blizzard. Hence what I said about central/western Europe where conditions are very rarely that bad and most of the roads are well maintained/cleared (unlike the UK).

I'm not gonna be racing, but I will be on decent Italian/Austrian roads and maybe the Autobahn.


Mon Sep 24, 2012 1:24 pm
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