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The Ranting (or Venting) Thread.
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Paul1965
I haven't seen my friends in so long
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 8:29 pm Posts: 5975
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Someone I know on Facebook has decided to post the name and age of each palestinian casualty - in separate posts, one at a time.
_________________ "I hadn't known there were so many idiots in the world until I started using the Internet." - Stanislaw Lem
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Wed Jul 30, 2014 5:07 pm |
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jonbwfc
What's a life?
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 7:26 pm Posts: 17040
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Well that's about as pointless a form of protest as I can think of.
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Wed Jul 30, 2014 5:10 pm |
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ProfessorF
What's a life?
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 7:56 pm Posts: 12030
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Perhaps, or perhaps not. Perhaps someone put it there out of the way rather than leaving it lying around in the way, this person may or may not have been the photographer. War is a funny place. Last year brought this up (also featuring some distraught Palestinians) where the photographer was accused of manipulating the image. So would asking a soldier to pose at his checkpoint with a rifle raised be ok? Asking a grieving woman to show the camera the passport of her dead husband be ok? Where is the line drawn between this is ok but that isn't? The notion that war photojournalism is entirely passive isn't true, and nor should it be.
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Wed Jul 30, 2014 5:13 pm |
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jonbwfc
What's a life?
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 7:26 pm Posts: 17040
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To be honest, when we're talking about photojournalism, I don't really see much difference between manipulating an image post facto in photoshop and manipulating an image by amending the scene at the time the photo is taken. Both are presenting the story the photographer wants us to see, not the story that is actually there. And that's dangerous. If a journalist deliberately left a section of a story out or added details in that weren't there without making it obvious that they were later embellishments on their part, would that be acceptable? No, it absolutely would not and the journalist would be panned for it. And if they did make it obvious, the publication would feel obliged to publish it as opinion, not fact. I don't want someone's opinion in a photograph, I want the facts. Simple, it just isn't. None of it. Just stand there and take the photo of what's happening. Be an observer. That's a really easy line to stick to. I think it should. It should be reportage, not editorial. If you have to 'dress up' the conflict to make your photos seem powerful a) You're distorting the events that happened which is not 'journalism' as it should be and/or b) You're not a good enough photographer. The images of war will speak for themselves, saying whatever they need to say. An unadulterated photo tells the truth. We have the right to expect the truth from the people who are there to show us what is happening in places like Gaza.
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Wed Jul 30, 2014 5:19 pm |
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ProfessorF
What's a life?
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 7:56 pm Posts: 12030
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However, your presence with a camera will affect how people around you react. You become part of the situation - people either will interact with you to show you something, or they'll try and ignore you with no regard for you being there. Some might actively send you away in a variety of ways. Some might involve guns. Any item of information is relayed via a medium, whether it's your mate in the pub or a screed of text in a publication. All of it is subject to the whims of our own internal editors before it even reaches an outlet. Simply by choosing your frame, or by selecting which images you present you are already presenting a version of the truth. There is no absolute truth in photography, just what someone wants us to see, and we put our trust in them to present their version of the truth - much like any other journalist might do.
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Wed Jul 30, 2014 9:44 pm |
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jonbwfc
What's a life?
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 7:26 pm Posts: 17040
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That doesn't give you the right to manipulate the image you're taking as you wish to fit an agenda. That's not journalism. Oh I agree - at the end of the day there's always the choice to take a photo or not take a photo. However a photograph, as long as we trust it to not have been manipulated, is an objective recording of a moment in time the way a retold story or written word simply is not. To say that because all photographs involve some level of subjectivity - possibly at a very metaphorical level - any manipulation of any photograph is acceptable is a spurious argument. It's like saying that because we can't ever remember all the exact details of any given situation therefore outright lying about that situation is fine. "What is truth?" has never been an argument anybody honest has ever had to try. The job of the photojournalist is to relay by images the truth of the situation in which they are placed. Not to decide what they think about the situation they are in and then manipulate the image to attempt to convince the viewer to share that opinion. Arguably, there is a place for photographs that do that but I would say they should be in art galleries, not on the front page of newspapers.
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Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:03 pm |
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ProfessorF
What's a life?
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 7:56 pm Posts: 12030
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My point was that by simply attending an event, you become a part of that experience. It's impossible to be an entirely neutral observer, as your subject will likely react differently to your presence than if you weren't there. Cameras are not invisible. By manipulation, do you include altering your framing or asking someone to step into the light? Or more specifically post production? Referring back to your initial observation that the wheel chair on the rubble was 'posed' - what evidence do you have for that position? That it doesn't feel 'right' to your notion of what a war zone should look like? If we accept that the photographer may as likely have been following your model of purely observational documentary photography, as being as likely that he deliberately placed the chair there, then what is the difference? The image being judged by us doesn't change, only our own notions of what preceded the image being taken. Your personal judgement of the image is that it was staged (although I'm not sure why that should be the case, it doesn't seem that incredible). I don't see that as necessarily being the case, nor that it matters in the greater context of covering this horrific event. I would suggest it's impossible for anyone to be in a war zone and not make decisions about what's happening around them. If you want that, perhaps some sort of time lapse drone photographer might be a better news gathering device. News outlets have guidelines about what is acceptable in the production of an image, and rightly so. Anyway, a thoroughly enjoyable exchange. 
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Thu Jul 31, 2014 12:51 pm |
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rustybucket
I haven't seen my friends in so long
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2009 5:10 pm Posts: 5836
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This place gets more retarded by the day 
_________________Jim
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Fri Aug 08, 2014 8:13 am |
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ProfessorF
What's a life?
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 7:56 pm Posts: 12030
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So does mine: I spend enough time queueing to leave work as it is!
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Fri Aug 08, 2014 8:50 am |
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paulzolo
What's a life?
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:27 pm Posts: 12251
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Bloody clients. Here's a situation for you. They have a website, but they don't like the current host. So I copy all the data and files to my server, where it works. All we need is the log in credentials for the domain name so I can change the name servers. Can we get that info? It seems not. Why? Because they are all older men, and one rather frail one seems to have this information. He can't find it. They have transferred the domain name from him to someone else, but he is still getting the emails about service renewals. This tells me that he's not given the new owner the login credentials, so the contact details for the domain name are wrong.
Got an email today saying that there are no log in details. Thing is, if anyone kicks off a password reset for the domain name the email will go to the original old boy. I get an email about this today. I'm taking the next two weeks off.
This has been going on for months - and I seem unable to resolve this. It is maddening. It's like herding cats.
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Fri Aug 08, 2014 11:00 am |
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finlay666
Spends far too much time on here
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 9:40 pm Posts: 4876 Location: Newcastle
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gitignores that are blindly ignored......
_________________TwitterCharlie Brooker: Macs are glorified Fisher-Price activity centres for adults; computers for scaredy cats too nervous to learn how proper computers work; computers for people who earnestly believe in feng shui.
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Fri Aug 08, 2014 11:17 am |
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oceanicitl
Official forum cat lady
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:04 am Posts: 11039 Location: London
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Are you talking about work, this forum or both? 
_________________Still the official cheeky one 
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Fri Aug 08, 2014 11:50 am |
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pcernie
Legend
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2009 12:30 pm Posts: 45931 Location: Belfast
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Taxi arrived quickly earlier and I didn't grab my key because there's always someone in the house. So of course my parents have decided to do the shopping at Monday rush hour. Utter fcuking idiots.
_________________Plain English advice on everything money, purchase and service related:
http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/
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Mon Aug 11, 2014 4:30 pm |
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pcernie
Legend
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2009 12:30 pm Posts: 45931 Location: Belfast
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And the idiocy continues. Captain Spastic is tiling the upstairs bathroom and apparently this is best achieved by slamming items into the floor so hard that the kitchen light flashes. In the middle of this the phone goes and it's someone with an indecipherable Irish accent from The Door Store - 'I'll get my dad to call you back, he's busy' says I. This then starts a massive argument with the Captain. Apparently he'd been waiting all day for this call. Yeah, it's my fault some genius waited until 8pm to get back to you and that I'm not psychic I lent this cnut and my mother £600 just a few hours beforehand, so I mean really?
_________________Plain English advice on everything money, purchase and service related:
http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/
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Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:23 pm |
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timark_uk
Moderator
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:11 pm Posts: 12143 Location: Belfast
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Ernie, families, eh?
Mark
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Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:47 pm |
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