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What the difference between a sofa and a couch is, and the origin of the word 'shibboleth'.


Fri Aug 08, 2014 3:34 pm
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jonbwfc wrote:
What the difference between a sofa and a couch is, and the origin of the word 'shibboleth'.


You're gonna have to explain all of that :lol:

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Fri Aug 08, 2014 4:06 pm
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Fri Aug 08, 2014 6:23 pm
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Sat Aug 09, 2014 6:10 pm
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pcernie wrote:
jonbwfc wrote:
What the difference between a sofa and a couch is, and the origin of the word 'shibboleth'.


You're gonna have to explain all of that :lol:


No idea on the first part, but 'shibboleth' used to be a password of sorts used by the Israelites. Apparently the other tribes couldn't pronounce the word correctly. It crops up in an episode of The West Wing.

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Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:19 am
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jonlumb wrote:
pcernie wrote:
jonbwfc wrote:
What the difference between a sofa and a couch is, and the origin of the word 'shibboleth'.


You're gonna have to explain all of that :lol:


No idea on the first part, but 'shibboleth' used to be a password of sorts used by the Israelites. Apparently the other tribes couldn't pronounce the word correctly. It crops up in an episode of The West Wing.


Ah...

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Mon Aug 11, 2014 9:01 am
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Indeed, A 'Shibboleth' is actually the word for a head of wheat in the ancient proto-hebrew tribal languages. One tribe were at war with another local tribe and controlled a vital river crossing. When anyone approached the crossing, the guards would hold up said head of wheat and ask them to name it. The other tribe didn't have a 'sh' sound in their language, so would pronounce it 'sibboleth'. So they would know who was them, and who was the other. Gruesomely, to protect the secret of the test, if the person crossing said 'sibboleth' they would murder them and chuck them in the river.

So a 'shibboleth' is a word whose pronunciation or use differentiates one group of people from another. Like the whole 'dinner vs lunch/tea' argument.

We got into this because we were trying to figure out whether sofa vs couch is a shibboleth - i.e. say working class people call them couches whereas middle class people call them sofas.

As it turns out, this isn't true, at least not technically. They are actually different pieces of furniture, with different origins. A 'couch' comes from the French word for 'to lie' and came about because women wearing very restrictive corsets would often reach the point of fainting and would have to lie down. A couch is basically just a large flat padded surface. A back was added later for privacy. A couch does not have arms.

A 'sofa' comes from the Arabic word 'soffa' and started off as basically a large chair two people can sit on next to each other. A sofa has a back and arms.


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Mon Aug 11, 2014 9:31 am
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How does "settee" fit into all this?

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Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:09 am
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According to wikipedia

"The word settee comes from the Old English word, "setl", which was used to describe long benches with high backs and arms"


Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:27 am
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Thu Aug 14, 2014 10:31 pm
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Although Stephen Fry has been gay for his entire adult life, he has never engaged in anal sex.

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Fri Aug 15, 2014 6:41 am
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Zippy wrote:
Although Stephen Fry has been gay for his entire adult life, he has never engaged in anal sex.

I've been straight all my life and neither have I!?

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Fri Aug 15, 2014 6:47 am
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I would have thought that anal sex is their version of vaginal sex; it'd be like saying you're straight but never had penetrative vaginal sex with a woman.

EDIT: Not that I care or want to know, but when Fry said that, was he referring to being the penetrator or the penetratee (there's proper medical terms for this but I can't remember and it's too early to care).

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Fri Aug 15, 2014 6:59 am
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Zippy wrote:
gay for his entire adult life


Of course, there are no gay children ;)


Fri Aug 15, 2014 7:32 am
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I was only using his words, he said "I've been gay for my entire adult life and have never engaged in anal sex" on a documentary I was listening to yesterday. I presume that since he followed it up with discussions of oral, frottage and mutual masterbation that he means it as both giver and receiver.

The only reason I brought it up is because it gave me pause for thought. I've always just assumed that was a part of the physical side of a male-gay relationship, I'd never really thought about the alternatives.

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