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Theresa May to revive her 'snooper's charter' 
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Theresa May to revive her 'snooper's charter' now Lib Dem brakes are off | Politics | The Guardian
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... y-election

The best we can hope for now is that the Tories overreach and do something remarkably unpopular; anything else will be a thousand cuts that bleeds the UK dry in every way.

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Sat May 09, 2015 3:31 pm
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pcernie wrote:
Theresa May to revive her 'snooper's charter' now Lib Dem brakes are off | Politics | The Guardian
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... y-election

The best we can hope for now is that the Tories overreach and do something remarkably unpopular; anything else will be a thousand cuts that bleeds the UK dry in every way.

The best we can hope for is that enough tories rebel that the opposition can kill this with fire. I'm not holding my breath though.

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Sat May 09, 2015 6:34 pm
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You're assuming labour will vote against it. They weren't particularly worried about personal privacy when they were in power and the tories are likely to try to get it through ASAP while they're in the midst of a leadership contest.


Sat May 09, 2015 6:41 pm
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jonbwfc wrote:
You're assuming labour will vote against it. They weren't particularly worried about personal privacy when they were in power and the tories are likely to try to get it through ASAP while they're in the midst of a leadership contest.

Well yes. Hence not holding my breath.

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Sat May 09, 2015 8:14 pm
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jonbwfc wrote:
You're assuming labour will vote against it. They weren't particularly worried about personal privacy when they were in power and the tories are likely to try to get it through ASAP while they're in the midst of a leadership contest.

Personally I'd expect them to go for the boundary changes first. They've been complaining about the unfair advantage Labour etc have for some time. They'll want to sort that out while they're strong.
Next I'd expect them to get through the devolution laws. Partly so they can say to the scots 'We're doing what we promised' and partly so they can push through English votes for English laws. I know there's some debate as to wether the best way to make it fair is to stop Scots voting on English issues in parliamene or have a seperate English parliament. Personally I perfer the former as the second adds more layers of rules and paperwork and more cost to the tax payer.

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Mon May 11, 2015 9:40 am
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l3v1ck wrote:
jonbwfc wrote:
You're assuming labour will vote against it. They weren't particularly worried about personal privacy when they were in power and the tories are likely to try to get it through ASAP while they're in the midst of a leadership contest.

Personally I'd expect them to go for the boundary changes first. They've been complaining about the unfair advantage Labour etc have for some time. They'll want to sort that out while they're strong.
Next I'd expect them to get through the devolution laws. Partly so they can say to the scots 'We're doing what we promised' and partly so they can push through English votes for English laws. I know there's some debate as to wether the best way to make it fair is to stop Scots voting on English issues in parliamene or have a seperate English parliament. Personally I perfer the former as the second adds more layers of rules and paperwork and more cost to the tax payer.


This time round the existing boundaries actually favoured the Tories - it generally required more votes for a labour MP to get in than a Tory one. Not that that will stop them 'correcting it' in their favour a bit more just to be really sure.

Personally I'd prefer a more federal type structure for the UK with a separate English parliament. It should all be wrapped up into a proper constitutional review that effectively gets rid of the house of Lords in it current form.
English votes for English laws all sounds very reasonable on the surface the problem is if Westminster is acting as the English and also UK parliament at the same time then there's a kind of conflict of interest - if something applies to England but affects the budget for the entire UK why shouldn't Scottish and Welsh MP's vote on it? The problem I see is that, in attempting to appease English MP's you just end up doing the SNP's job for them. Given the Tories virtually non-existent representation is Scotland it's going to be very tempting to really stick the boot in too as in the long run it's likely to do more harm to Labour and the Lib Dems anyway.

At the time of the independence referendum I thought that the SNP were actually playing a much longer game than they were given credit for. If they'd actually won stuff would have happened all at once. Now they not only get greater fiscal autonomy and the experience of running the system for a while within the wider UK framework but now the Tories are going to effectively give them additional ammo and potentially an even bigger mandate at the elections next year to argue that Scotland should get out of the UK if their MP's have been cut out of any actual influence at Westminster and if the English are pushing for an EU exit that Scotland is far less keen on.

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Mon May 11, 2015 10:17 am
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davrosG5 wrote:
l3v1ck wrote:
jonbwfc wrote:
You're assuming labour will vote against it. They weren't particularly worried about personal privacy when they were in power and the tories are likely to try to get it through ASAP while they're in the midst of a leadership contest.

Personally I'd expect them to go for the boundary changes first. They've been complaining about the unfair advantage Labour etc have for some time. They'll want to sort that out while they're strong.
Next I'd expect them to get through the devolution laws. Partly so they can say to the scots 'We're doing what we promised' and partly so they can push through English votes for English laws. I know there's some debate as to wether the best way to make it fair is to stop Scots voting on English issues in parliamene or have a seperate English parliament. Personally I perfer the former as the second adds more layers of rules and paperwork and more cost to the tax payer.


This time round the existing boundaries actually favoured the Tories - it generally required more votes for a labour MP to get in than a Tory one. Not that that will stop them 'correcting it' in their favour a bit more just to be really sure.

Personally I'd prefer a more federal type structure for the UK with a separate English parliament. It should all be wrapped up into a proper constitutional review that effectively gets rid of the house of Lords in it current form.
English votes for English laws all sounds very reasonable on the surface the problem is if Westminster is acting as the English and also UK parliament at the same time then there's a kind of conflict of interest - if something applies to England but affects the budget for the entire UK why shouldn't Scottish and Welsh MP's vote on it? The problem I see is that, in attempting to appease English MP's you just end up doing the SNP's job for them. Given the Tories virtually non-existent representation is Scotland it's going to be very tempting to really stick the boot in too as in the long run it's likely to do more harm to Labour and the Lib Dems anyway.

At the time of the independence referendum I thought that the SNP were actually playing a much longer game than they were given credit for. If they'd actually won stuff would have happened all at once. Now they not only get greater fiscal autonomy and the experience of running the system for a while within the wider UK framework but now the Tories are going to effectively give them additional ammo and potentially an even bigger mandate at the elections next year to argue that Scotland should get out of the UK if their MP's have been cut out of any actual influence at Westminster and if the English are pushing for an EU exit that Scotland is far less keen on.


im not going into everything line by line but if we do not head down the road of a type of federal style of Govt. the union is lost
a federal type of governance would be able to stop the breakup of the UK, but are the English willing to go there, i am

the key to this issue is does the EU recognise separate states within a federal democratic union, i do believe that is the case ...

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Mon May 11, 2015 12:53 pm
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Personally I'd rather the scots have independance. That was we save on the unfair barnet formula and any extra debt the spend happy scottich government does won't affect us.

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Mon May 11, 2015 3:16 pm
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