The pound started tanking


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it will not tank as much as the Euro when we put in place article 50 ...

reasons for leaving ...
1. control of borders and immigration
2. a set time limit (5 years) to claim benefits for non UK
3. security maintained within our own borders
4. British courts have the final judgement
5. only allowing and using the EEA (Euro economic area aka EEC)
6 securing wages and employment within the UK
7. British law supersedes EU law
8. maintaining the NHS for the UK (not a WHS)
9. places for education at schools without them being overloaded
10. lower housing and rent costs due to lower demand
and lastly (i can state more) but not least sovereignty

just a few (not necessarily in order) just off of the top of my head
ps. if anybody wishes to take me on regarding EU fcuking employment law, please do
( i will pi$$ all over you. i siht you not)

remember there will be lies, damned lies, fiddled statistics and bucket loads of Govt. misinformation about the end of the known universe if we leave the EU. vote OUT.

One could say that's a good thing (although not for my Holiday to Amsterdam in a couple of weeks)
- Exports cheaper so Co's can export more
- Imports more expensive so more likely to by local

Its not good for my English pension either!

That's fine for stuff we can produce here, how about bananas, milk ( UK become non self sufficient in 2014), meat, medication etc?
Right now it's only lost 5%, but what if it lost 50%?


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Still the same list of stuff that apparently needs to be fixed, but still no mention of how though. There's going to be seismic shifts in a lot of areas, yet no one in the out camp is saying how they will address these, and what the implications will be. Who will win? Who will lose?

For example : we ship home all those people from the EU who no longer qualify to live or work here. That's a lot of people, and a lot of jobs - mostly unskilled or blue collar - that will need to be filled. However, decades of being told that university is the only way to get work and progress means that a lot of that kind of work is considered too lowly to do. So that means farmers will have problems getting in crops. Fewer plumbers. And so on. Ho do you propose ensuring that those jobs are staffed at levels that minimise impact?

I would also direct your attention to issues wher tech companies have abused their positions of monopoly, or where they have tried to implement things that are morally or legally dubious. If you remember the company Phorm that wanted to set up some kind of behavioural advertising platform that would have put a huge question mark in data gathered, its use and security, you will also remember the indifference that our government showed to the abuses of data laws (Phorm secretly ran trails with BT). It took the intervention of the EU to make things happen - Phorm was last need trying to peddle it's wares in southern America. The EU appears to hold consumers' rights higher than corporate interests in such matters, a stance that is far better than our own government. What systems will be in place to ensure that something like Phorm doesn't happen again if we do leave the EU?

We have NO IDEA. There are no plans or roadmaps available for such things, and if you want me to even consider an "out vote" then that list of tabloid friendly gripes above is meaningless to without substantial,plans to back them up. I'll remind you - this debate has been clanking on for more than a decade. If there is no plan now, then that's a massive fail on the part of those who what us to leave.

There was an interesting article on El Reg yesterday about the new data protection laws in the UK, which are pending and tied to the European policy. The long and short of it was, even if the UK leaves the EU and moves into just being in the EEA, it will still need to implement the DP law (HDPR?), if it wanted to do business in Europe.

This is the same problem the USA is currently having with the Safe Harbour agreement being declared null and void. If the UK pulls out, it will have to negotiate its own form of Safe Harbour with the EU, in order to store personally identifiable data originating in the EU, or about EU persons. If the HDPR is not in place, then it will not be able to do electronic business with the EU, as it cannot guarantee the data will be held and treated to EU standards, which is required.

So a lot of the UK banking sector, which deals with Europe, would have to up sticks and move across the channel, if it wanted to continue doing business.

In fact, the EU commission has been threatening to take the UK DPO to court for 3 years, because the new DP bill has not been past and the 1998 act has been declared inadequate to fulfill the UK's responsibilities.

the GDPR has not been fully drawn up yet also most eastern european members of the eu have stated that they would not be able to implement the GDPR fully for many years
this was at the last eu security conference end of 2015 ...

One thing all sides seem to more or less agree on is the UK seems to be more a of a stickler for 'the rules' than the rest of the EU. I suspect if the rule comes in, UK companies will be faced with implementing it in pretty swift order, regardless of whether Poland (as an example) may be dragging their feet about it.

Actually in this case though in/out doesn't seem to matter - companies will be faced with implementing it either if they are within the EU, or if they want to store and process data from entities within the EU. So it's essentially a sunk cost. There's nothing to be gained from moving out of the UK into the EU, because the rules will have to be implemented either way, assuming they want to carry on doing business with entities in the EU. This is for this specific legislation, whether that holds overall is a separate question.

Jonathan

Iain Duncan Smith: David Cameron's EU deal will do nothing to reduce migration | Politics | The Guardian
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... -migration

Isn't it remarkable how he makes a lot of sense when it suits him?

Not so much as Germany, they really like their rules. But a lot of their rules actually define your freedom.

But even so, if the new members don't adapt their DP legislation, they can't exchange data electronically with the rest of Europe.

Some people seem to think that the UK is put under extra scrutiny, where in fact every country has to do the same and they have to meet deadlines and they get into trouble if they drag their feet. The problem is, the UK doesn't seem to want to use any of the benefits (or allow its population to apply for them) and then the Government can bellyache about how bad the EU is, when they want to do something dodgy.

As a consumer or a small business, I can't see a single thing that would stop you from wanting EU level DP. The current DP in the UK is only good for big business and government snooping, which is why the EU keeps telling the UK to get its act together, as it is at odds with the ideals of the EU, to protect its citizens.

(Edit: The last part wasn't aimed at you Jon )

That's been my feeling too. It feels like the UK government does not claim what it is entitled from the EU just to say " look the EU is worthless". For example, they've never claimed from the flood relief fund, for either Somerset or Cumbria floods while being entitled to millions of euros. https://www.eureporter.co/frontpage/201 ... od-relief/
Baffling or purposefully done as if it was DC's plan all along.


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EU membership: 'UK cannot be an island in science' | Politics | The Guardian
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... in-science

I've no idea how much our scientific expertise is reliant on Europe - I'm not sure either group there is either.

A lot of research these days is international. No one entity has the funding or the combined expertise, or they collect people together - look at CERN.

Reasons for staying:

1. We have never had control of our borders or immigration. We have pretend control of ports but our coastline is 19000 miles long so anyone who really wanted to get here could.
   
   Every so-called Englishman is ethnically German, French or Scandinavian, the Queen is ethnically German and she's married to a Greek, fish & chips are Jewish, tea is Indian, our national dish is Curry, two of our most popular foods are Lasagne and Chicken Kiev. Our culture and economy depend entirely on immigration
   
   
2. A set time for the over 2 Million UK ex-pats to be forced to return to the UK
   
   
3. Our security is maintained by American missiles, German helicopters and pan-European fighters all of which are heavily based on electronics made in China, Taiwan and Thailand and used on the basis of overseas intelligence and United Nations resolutions
   
   
4. British courts still wouldn't have final judgement. The UK would still be subject to the European Court of Human Rights, which is NOTHING to do with the EU.
   
   The British pubic has no control over any court, British or otherwise. I fail therefore to understand why the British courts which we don't control are better than any other. Also, nobody seems to mind that the UK's Christopher Vajda QC gets to rule on other countries' jurisdictions.
   
   
5. Being a member of the EEA would entail having to pay the same amount of money into the EU and obey most of the same trade rules as we do at the moment but without getting to set any of the rules
   
   
6. Wages and Employment can only be secured within the UK when all overseas companies leave the UK and we don't trade with any other country. North Korea has a similar system.
   
   
7. I have no faith in UK law when the UK Legislature is run by and for rich people. You seem to be asserting that laws made by rich overlords are better than other laws made by other rich overlords.
   
   
8. We could easily require everyone to present health insurance details when using the NHS. I have my NHS Health Insurance Card in my wallet. We should do this anyway and don't need to leave the EU to do it.
   
   
9. Schools up North are being shut due to lack of demand. The South East is overcrowded, but that's the South East's fault and nobody else's.
   
   
10. Entire districts up North and in the provinces are lying empty due to lack of demand. The South East is overcrowded, but that's the South East's fault and nobody else's.

Remember there will be lies, damned lies, fiddled statistics and bucket loads of misinformation about the mushroom-fuelled, white-supremacist hallucination that is the dream of leaving the EU.

Vote IN