This is why going to jail should be punishment, not a treat!

What should happen in jails is this:

- very basic, uncomfortable bed + bedding.
- food should be like gruel but at least nutritionally complete.
- yard time should be just that - go into a yard. No baseball/football games etc.

That's it. No playstations and internet access. You're a criminal - you don't have the right to play games and arse around on facebook. No fancy foods. There are people who can't afford basic foods, who can only dream of internet and computing. Prison should be worse than this. It should be so horrible, no one would want to go.

Please, sort yourself out a visit to a prison. Spend some time in there, look around. I've toured both Wandsworth (3 times) and Dartmoor (once), and they aren't happy places, I certainly wouldn't want to spend any time in there. Go and see it for yourself, then make a decision. The feeling of having a cell door close and lock is not a nice one, and I knew I'd be walking out in a matter of minutes.

Whether being locked in the cell is a pleasant experience or not is neither here nor there! The point is WTF is he doing being able to spend time on Facebook et al? Or playing games on a playstation etc.

Books and learning material, including CBT in a classroom, fine. Games and Internet surfing? WTF!

Yet another gaping hole in the carrotless, but barely-a-stick approach to criminal justice in this country. It needs to be socially unnacceptable to burgle people. It also needs to be made harder by stronger communities. And when somebody does do it, and then ends up killing someone, they need to be locked up until they beg for release, repent and understand how lucky to be alive they are.

Clearly, that's not what's currently happening. And yet, if that guy had killed a cop, it would be different.

Apparently, according to the report, “it seems he has had a mobile phone smuggled in for him to get on to the internet."
This isn't a case of the system sitting him down in front of a PC, but a symptom of the smuggling problem.

Quite frankly if you're not going to have any rec. time for the prisoners then you're going to have a bunch of stir-crazy riotous prisoners on your hands, with very few prison staff to deal with it.

I agree that luxuries such as PlayStations and internet access should be off-limits, but there at least needs to be some sort of entertainment - sports, a library etc, and above all an opportunity to make something better of yourself for when you get out.

I agree with the Prof, having had a tour around Dartmoor and seen how prisoners have to live I certainly wouldn't want to go. Also having seen what prisoners do to other prisoners and what they hide up their backside, I'd be very, very wary.

+1

Thing is, you and the Prof are (AFAIK) quite reasonable people with an adequate idea of right and wrong, morals and values that you stick to. Many offenders and re-offenders just don't give a t0ss, they don't care about going to prison, they don't care about going back again and again.

I agree that a library, a gym, the opportunity to do distance learning etc is all very well, but no TV, no games, no internet, and food should be basic nutrition. They can have the choice of things like newspapers etc but entertainment should be basic, a few footballs, some sports equipment in the yard, if they get bored/trouble etc then they can be locked up on their own in their own cells. Prison should be bad, it should be a horrible experience with limited outside contact otherwise it's position as deterrent becomes a joke.

I'm still 100% on the side of punative coma. Each offender would only need a bed and monitoring equipment for their entire sentence, trapped in their own heads for the entire time, they'd give no trouble, need minimal care, have no fun, no gourmet food, no games and no contact with the outside world. We could fit more of them into the square footage we already have and I doubt many people would be so laissez faire about multiple occasions of that.

You could teach them to knit as well

The two I've been around are a horrible experience.
There are issues with people becoming institutionalised and finding life (however basic it is) on the inside easier to deal with that making their way on the outside.



However, this doesn't gel at all with the idea of punishment and rehabilitation. You want to put me in a coma for 5 years? Fine. I'd gladly choose that than going to gaol. That, to my mind, is no punishment at all.

Demolition Man reference FTW!

That does describe US jails and they are full. They even send prisoners across the country because they are full. Imagine getting sent to Romania to serve your time. Where you would have no contact with your lawyers or family.

Actually coping with prison a a trick of the mind. So many who cope well say they have trapped my body and not my mind or something similar. If you have that mentality you will cope. As long as you can avoid any trouble you can survive.

I wonder if you'd feel the same if it was a life sentence? Completely out of touch with your life for 25 years or more? No exercise, no outside world, no tv, no real food, no pleasure at all, no visitors, nothing but the dreams and imaginings from your own brain. From a rehabilitation point of view you're right, but I don't believe jail is about rehabilitation now, and from what I've seen, it doesn't seem to be much about punishment either.

I'm sure that some people going to jail use the experience to ensure they never ever go back, but I'm also sure others see it as 'living rent free' for a number of years in better conditions than some children are raised.

In my mind, the choices seem to be a) make prison something to be feared and abhorred or 2) come up with something that will be. The current system doesn't seem to be working and punative coma would solve many of the current problems involved in the prison system, perhaps wait until the offender is re-awakened, off-balance, vulnerable and out of touch with their old ways and then set them on a rigorous rehab course?!?

Living rent free is a joke. If you are found innocent at appeal you will get a huge settlement, but it will be reduced by the costs of accommodation for x years for which you should never be there in the first place.