Lost wasn't canned. Alex and Bob asked for an end date. It was ABC that wanted to milk it. The end date has given it something to work towards. They've been working towards it for more than two seasons now and it shows.

Heroes was a neatly wrapped package in season 1. The final seconds of the finale opening up a whole host of exciting new possibilities. The volumes concept was a good one. Also, season 2 with Adam Monroe and the rest of the new characters was well conceived. I'm even prepared to stick my neck out and say that the season 2 was (given the strike) well executed and though not as good as season 1, enjoyable. Season 3 was a mess but had tons of great bits and a fair few good eps. Michael Dorn was a nice touch at the mid-season finale of Villians and the Fugitives opener was very exciting. Fugitives was overall I thought, somewhat of a return to form.

Season 4 has been a vast improvement overall with only a couple of eps that I got a bit tired of. Robert Knepper, as I've already said, brings something fresh. Also, the repercussions of the Fugitives finale leave a lasting mark. Redemption shows the most promise since season 1 IMO. However, that doesn't change the fact that I'm reserving judgement until the end of the season.

Lost on the other hand, has already proved it's back on track. And quite a while ago. That's all I'm trying to say.

Umm …
I know what you're saying. I like both Lost and Heroes and I just can't really say that one show is greater than the other for the reason I gave above that you seemingly took issue at with my wording. (8+)
I appreciate your views on stuff like this and I always read with interest how you view this stuff.

Mark

I appreciate that Mark. I now you're just as much of a TV geek as me (8-p

It's just that the writers of Lost had a plan and the network interfered. That's when things went a bit off. You and I both know that although that's usually Fox's job, it wouldn't be the first time and it won't be the last. When I say "canned", I mean the network cancelling a show against the wishes of the producers and/or punters. Asking for an end date and getting it (albeit 2yrs in the future) is different in my book and to be commended.

The very first show that I can remember (since I've been religious about TV, so only about 15yrs or so) that had a fixed arc and stuck to it was Bab 5 and let's face it. It worked. In my book, without that arc in place, you need either:
a) Very good standalone eps (there are fewer and fewer examples of this in the last 5yrs)
or
b) an arc per season, with a beginning middle and end e.g. 24

An example of a show with seemingly no "fixed arc" but everywhere to go that worked better than Heroes-post-season 1 (IMO) is Jericho. Although there was a general background arc, the story could have gone anywhere and handled non-arc eps well along with superb integration of individual character stories. Of course that was canned. Threshold - another superb example.

I would love to hear of any shows that don't have an obvious arc, that are good, and that aren't soaps or sitcoms. I **LOVE** How I Met Your Mother, but even that has an arc and it's fairly strongly set out from day one. I guess what I'm trying to say, is that anything without that kind of direction turns into The Simpsons or Eastenders. But I'd love to be proven wrong....

It won't be by me, at least not here and now at any rate.
I really liked Jericho, and that had great possibilities to go places in the future, it really was a shame that it got cancelled.

Mark

Anybody else....?

Heroes Series 3 lost the way for me a little, but I stuck with it. The latest series, series 4, is much better. I'm sure, if I'd seen it, then I'd really enjoy it. Erm.

Heroes?

It lost me when

a) It killed off every character I cared about.

b) It brought some back to life again in one implausible way or another.


Even for heroes dead should be dead.

Just watched the first couple of episodes of this series on BBC3, and I'm kinda wandering what I missed in the last series. It seems OK, and since if follows Being Human every Sunday then there's a good chance I might watch it.

I don't know what is about these big American series' but I always seem to miss the boat.

24, Lost, and Heroes are three that I've never got into.

I can handle 24 - and have seen a couple of episodes.

But I just can't handle Lost - it's all so over-dramatic and un-realistic that it bugs me.

As for Heroes, I've never seen it at all.

So that's a no then.

JJ, what you missed was a jumble of ideas from a writing team in flux. Providing you know who the characters are, you'll be fine and you're in for a much better season.
CC, have you never read a comic?! Dead is rarely dead. A little implausibility should be allowed. Care to furnish us with an example?
Nick, what do you watch? Anything American grab you?

Mark, can you think of a single show that proves me wrong now you've had some time? I'm struggling...

One thing that really screwed with my head in season 3 was the whole Nathan/Sylar thing.

I couldn't remember who was who, I'm still unsure and I think I'll need to read a synopsis to get my head around what happened that season.

It has been some time since I watched it.

The Jessica? woman with the split personality was killed and then came back as a clone or some such nonsense. The Cheerleaders dad was brought back from the dead by her blood at some point. Though I don't know if they brought back others the same way or not.

Miracle blood, was that plotline ever built on? I lost interest at that point.

Niki Sanders (Jessica was her alter ego) was part of an experiment in the desert back in the day and it turns out she was one of 3 identical triplets who were experimented on. She wasn't a clone. Granted HRG coming back from Claire's blood was a little weak, but the odd misstep is forgiveable and given he's one of the more interesting characters, you've gotta allow them some licence.
Miracle blood wasn't exactly built on, but we did discover some very special in a related way (without spoilers!)

I think you could probably jump straight into season 4 and see what you think. You probably know enough. Try it, it's loads better than the last two seasons.

I find Wikipedia's good enough for that sort of thing

Yeah, it would help to know who was a goodie and who was a baddie too. They seemed to switch sides more often than barn dancers on speed.